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Wechat: NEXIABET Whatsapp: +66944385708 6 00:00:13,472 --> 00:00:16,182 Good morning. 7 00:00:16,183 --> 00:00:18,434 Have you ever heard of Batman? 8 00:00:18,435 --> 00:00:19,353 Yes. 9 00:00:19,354 --> 00:00:21,145 Just checking and just kidding. 10 00:00:21,146 --> 00:00:22,897 Of course you already heard about Batman. 11 00:00:22,898 --> 00:00:24,357 So I have the honor of 12 00:00:24,358 --> 00:00:26,734 invited to speak around the world 13 00:00:26,735 --> 00:00:29,278 to tell the story You will hear. 14 00:00:29,279 --> 00:00:30,239 And wherever I go, 15 00:00:30,240 --> 00:00:32,198 is it Tanzania in Africa 16 00:00:32,199 --> 00:00:33,824 or Chile in South America 17 00:00:33,825 --> 00:00:35,493 or Hong Kong or Thailand 18 00:00:35,494 --> 00:00:37,161 or United Arab Emirates, 19 00:00:37,162 --> 00:00:39,539 wherever I go, I show that symbol, 20 00:00:39,540 --> 00:00:40,873 and I have never been to school 21 00:00:40,874 --> 00:00:44,335 anywhere in the world where someone doesn't know that. 22 00:00:44,336 --> 00:00:46,879 Now don't worry if you are not interested in superheroes 23 00:00:46,880 --> 00:00:49,090 because I've finished this many times, 24 00:00:49,091 --> 00:00:52,134 and I can guarantee everyone here, including staff, 25 00:00:52,135 --> 00:00:54,845 You will come out this room in one hour 26 00:00:54,846 --> 00:00:56,305 with a different perspective 27 00:00:56,306 --> 00:00:59,183 than you have now, I guarantee it. 28 00:00:59,184 --> 00:01:03,604 In every Batman story since first in 1939, 29 00:01:03,605 --> 00:01:06,399 there is only one name in the credit limit. 30 00:01:06,400 --> 00:01:09,819 "Batman was created by Bob Kane." 31 00:01:09,820 --> 00:01:11,946 Here he is. 32 00:01:11,947 --> 00:01:16,867 And this is the problem about the credit limit: 33 00:01:16,868 --> 00:01:20,830 That's not true. 34 00:01:20,831 --> 00:01:28,831 ♪ 35 00:01:41,393 --> 00:01:42,560 The reason I explained why 36 00:01:42,561 --> 00:01:44,228 that I like super heroes little pat, 37 00:01:44,229 --> 00:01:46,063 and it might be a a little dishonest 38 00:01:46,064 --> 00:01:48,649 because I don't think like this since childhood. 39 00:01:48,650 --> 00:01:52,611 ♪ 40 00:01:52,612 --> 00:01:54,739 But I like stories unselfish 41 00:01:54,740 --> 00:01:56,741 and I like sacrifice stories, 42 00:01:56,742 --> 00:02:01,746 and superheroes sacrifice something every day. 43 00:02:01,747 --> 00:02:06,917 ♪ 44 00:02:06,918 --> 00:02:08,419 Superheroes don't do this 45 00:02:08,420 --> 00:02:11,339 to be paid or praised, and this is not about them. 46 00:02:11,340 --> 00:02:13,549 They do something for the greater good, 47 00:02:13,550 --> 00:02:15,843 then they disappear until night. 48 00:02:15,844 --> 00:02:18,179 ♪ 49 00:02:18,180 --> 00:02:21,891 The idea of that is very rare in real life. 50 00:02:21,892 --> 00:02:23,351 I mean, we know only a few people 51 00:02:23,352 --> 00:02:26,020 who can become selfless. 52 00:02:26,021 --> 00:02:29,523 ♪ 53 00:02:29,524 --> 00:02:31,651 As a six-year-old child, I don't think like that, 54 00:02:31,652 --> 00:02:34,111 even as 12 or 15 years. 55 00:02:34,112 --> 00:02:35,279 I only like good stories, 56 00:02:35,280 --> 00:02:36,572 a good adventure, and I still do it, 57 00:02:36,573 --> 00:02:38,824 so that's a combination of those things, 58 00:02:38,825 --> 00:02:40,660 purity of this goal 59 00:02:40,661 --> 00:02:43,704 then just a hanging a big cliff, 60 00:02:43,705 --> 00:02:45,956 a rollicking adventure. 61 00:02:45,957 --> 00:02:53,957 ♪ 62 00:03:10,524 --> 00:03:12,942 This is Batman's part. 63 00:03:12,943 --> 00:03:17,196 One two three four full ... almost full of shelves. 64 00:03:17,197 --> 00:03:20,325 And compare it with Superman. 65 00:03:21,827 --> 00:03:22,952 Don't tap Superman, 66 00:03:22,953 --> 00:03:25,246 but only see reality. 67 00:03:25,247 --> 00:03:27,915 This is Superman arrived there. 68 00:03:27,916 --> 00:03:31,335 Batman is not only the most identifiable 69 00:03:31,336 --> 00:03:32,920 and recognizable and famous 70 00:03:32,921 --> 00:03:34,004 and beloved superhero, 71 00:03:34,005 --> 00:03:36,465 but he is one of them the easiest to recognize 72 00:03:36,466 --> 00:03:38,175 fiction characters all the time. 73 00:03:38,176 --> 00:03:40,719 Can take almost everything Batman books from the shelf 74 00:03:40,720 --> 00:03:44,682 and open the title page. 75 00:03:44,683 --> 00:03:46,892 "Batman was created by Bob Kane." 76 00:03:46,893 --> 00:03:50,938 ♪ 77 00:03:50,939 --> 00:03:53,983 Bob, for some people who are from another planet, 78 00:03:53,984 --> 00:03:55,860 who might not know what you are doing, 79 00:03:55,861 --> 00:03:58,154 What is it? You are known? 80 00:03:58,155 --> 00:03:59,280 You must be kidding. 81 00:03:59,281 --> 00:04:00,865 I am of course. 82 00:04:00,866 --> 00:04:04,034 Bob Kane is original Batman 83 00:04:04,035 --> 00:04:06,370 cartoonist and the man who owns it is credited to Batman 84 00:04:06,371 --> 00:04:08,164 for most of Batman's history. 85 00:04:08,165 --> 00:04:09,832 When I was 18, I stumbled 86 00:04:09,833 --> 00:04:11,250 character called Batman. 87 00:04:11,251 --> 00:04:12,543 Bat... how are you doing? say that? 88 00:04:12,544 --> 00:04:15,212 - Batman? - B-A-T-man. 89 00:04:15,213 --> 00:04:17,631 Formerly called "Batman by Robert Kane." 90 00:04:17,632 --> 00:04:21,594 In 1938, two young children 91 00:04:21,595 --> 00:04:23,053 from Cleveland, Ohio 92 00:04:23,054 --> 00:04:26,307 sell ideas for characters named Superman. 93 00:04:26,308 --> 00:04:28,893 Superman is very large influence on Bob Kane, 94 00:04:28,894 --> 00:04:32,062 not the creative side, financial side. 95 00:04:32,063 --> 00:04:33,898 So I think, yes, 96 00:04:33,899 --> 00:04:35,816 "How much money Make Siegel and Shuster?" 97 00:04:35,817 --> 00:04:38,027 They are creators of Superman. 98 00:04:38,028 --> 00:04:39,445 And at that time, in the year & apos; 39, 99 00:04:39,446 --> 00:04:42,239 they are making $ 800 per week. 100 00:04:42,240 --> 00:04:44,867 When Bob Kane is found how much money 101 00:04:44,868 --> 00:04:47,661 creator of Superman make every week 102 00:04:47,662 --> 00:04:49,580 which is $ 800 at the time, 103 00:04:49,581 --> 00:04:51,290 he goes to an editor at National. 104 00:04:51,291 --> 00:04:54,919 He said, "Listen, Bob, can you do another superhero?" 105 00:04:54,920 --> 00:04:56,086 I say, "For that kind of money, 106 00:04:56,087 --> 00:04:57,254 You will have it on Monday. " 107 00:04:57,255 --> 00:04:58,964 For that kind of money, You will become a super hero. 108 00:04:58,965 --> 00:05:00,049 Wow, you better believe that. 109 00:05:00,050 --> 00:05:02,927 I will steal it somewhere. 110 00:05:02,928 --> 00:05:04,804 And I go home, and look 111 00:05:04,805 --> 00:05:07,014 I think of all my childhood heroes 112 00:05:07,015 --> 00:05:10,142 when I was little and my fantasy world. 113 00:05:10,143 --> 00:05:11,435 And on Monday, I come 114 00:05:11,436 --> 00:05:14,271 Batman's images are very rough. 115 00:05:14,272 --> 00:05:16,315 And the rest history that Batman... 116 00:05:16,316 --> 00:05:19,401 Batman is my claim for ugliness. 117 00:05:19,402 --> 00:05:25,783 ♪ 118 00:05:25,784 --> 00:05:27,785 Well, like most adults who like superheroes, 119 00:05:27,786 --> 00:05:29,578 My interest starts when I was little. 120 00:05:29,579 --> 00:05:31,121 I just don't can ever handle it. 121 00:05:31,122 --> 00:05:35,125 And it starts passion that I have most of my life. 122 00:05:35,126 --> 00:05:36,377 I have a little gap in adolescence 123 00:05:36,378 --> 00:05:39,046 when I have to distance myself myself from various things 124 00:05:39,047 --> 00:05:42,341 that can enter girl's way and life, 125 00:05:42,342 --> 00:05:43,843 but for the most part , I've been stuck 126 00:05:43,844 --> 00:05:46,512 with superheroes all my life. 127 00:05:46,513 --> 00:05:49,098 I am a writer books for young people, 128 00:05:49,099 --> 00:05:51,225 and some of them books for all ages. 129 00:05:51,226 --> 00:05:53,143 And I have written about 75 books. 130 00:05:53,144 --> 00:05:55,813 This is my first book. 131 00:05:55,814 --> 00:05:57,690 Felix's Activity Book. 132 00:05:57,691 --> 00:06:01,151 Tour de force, I'm sure you remember it well since 1996. 133 00:06:01,152 --> 00:06:03,279 And this is the sequel to this epic, 134 00:06:03,280 --> 00:06:04,905 Felix Exploring Our World. 135 00:06:04,906 --> 00:06:07,241 I think it repeats my nonfiction theme 136 00:06:07,242 --> 00:06:09,493 are countless stories. 137 00:06:09,494 --> 00:06:10,703 Boys of Steel. 138 00:06:10,704 --> 00:06:13,455 Biography Jerry Siegel and Joe Shuster, 139 00:06:13,456 --> 00:06:15,165 creator of Superman. 140 00:06:15,166 --> 00:06:17,126 Sometimes there are tragic stories 141 00:06:17,127 --> 00:06:19,336 behind these iconic characters. 142 00:06:19,337 --> 00:06:24,008 Marc likes to bring out the story behind a story, 143 00:06:24,009 --> 00:06:25,843 so he goes far, 144 00:06:25,844 --> 00:06:27,887 and he is also very too 145 00:06:27,888 --> 00:06:29,555 as a human. 146 00:06:29,556 --> 00:06:31,056 You get two toothpaste because you don't know 147 00:06:31,057 --> 00:06:32,683 if I want fluoride or not? 148 00:06:32,684 --> 00:06:34,894 - Yes - Because they just announced 149 00:06:34,895 --> 00:06:36,186 fluoride is poison now. 150 00:06:36,187 --> 00:06:37,396 I know that. 151 00:06:37,397 --> 00:06:38,397 I've told you all along. 152 00:06:38,398 --> 00:06:40,107 In water, it's in toothpaste. 153 00:06:40,108 --> 00:06:41,358 No, I know it's there, but that doesn't mean 154 00:06:41,359 --> 00:06:43,694 - This is poison. - Oh, are you recording us? 155 00:06:43,695 --> 00:06:45,237 I definitely feel sometimes 156 00:06:45,238 --> 00:06:46,864 that I'm not just married to a writer, 157 00:06:46,865 --> 00:06:50,492 but even also more than that detective. 158 00:06:50,493 --> 00:06:51,869 When I decided to write a book 159 00:06:51,870 --> 00:06:55,414 in the story behind Batman, it's not finished yet. 160 00:06:55,415 --> 00:06:57,041 Whenever you start a research project, 161 00:06:57,042 --> 00:06:58,876 You can't know how many 162 00:06:58,877 --> 00:07:00,210 or how small you will find. 163 00:07:00,211 --> 00:07:03,005 In this case, I will go into the Batman 164 00:07:03,006 --> 00:07:04,632 book knowing that there are secrets 165 00:07:04,633 --> 00:07:06,592 not yet discussed a lot, 166 00:07:06,593 --> 00:07:11,639 but I have no way to find out much more than that. 167 00:07:11,640 --> 00:07:12,640 So this story, for me, 168 00:07:12,641 --> 00:07:16,268 reveal a secret great superhero 169 00:07:16,269 --> 00:07:20,022 which should be blown several decades ago. 170 00:07:20,023 --> 00:07:21,398 ♪ 171 00:07:21,399 --> 00:07:22,609 (car horn horn) 172 00:07:24,152 --> 00:07:26,570 In New York in 1965, 173 00:07:26,571 --> 00:07:28,614 is the first official Comic Con, 174 00:07:28,615 --> 00:07:31,075 and that reason is considered 175 00:07:31,076 --> 00:07:32,701 The first official Con Comic 176 00:07:32,702 --> 00:07:34,119 because it is the first time 177 00:07:34,120 --> 00:07:35,537 that professionals appear, 178 00:07:35,538 --> 00:07:38,123 not just fans a hotel basement 179 00:07:38,124 --> 00:07:39,708 with some problems back. 180 00:07:39,709 --> 00:07:42,336 It's historic, this is a big problem. 181 00:07:42,337 --> 00:07:43,462 They don't know it at the time, 182 00:07:43,463 --> 00:07:44,797 but that's a big problem. 183 00:07:44,798 --> 00:07:47,591 There are 200 of us at that time Comic Con. 184 00:07:47,592 --> 00:07:49,593 ♪ 185 00:07:49,594 --> 00:07:51,887 And this place is very faint. 186 00:07:51,888 --> 00:07:53,847 And we got there, and my mother panicked 187 00:07:53,848 --> 00:07:55,599 when he sees where we are. 188 00:07:55,600 --> 00:07:58,185 There is literally a drunk man, unconscious 189 00:07:58,186 --> 00:07:59,645 on the floor in the lobby, 190 00:07:59,646 --> 00:08:02,022 and cockroaches on the wall, and he just said, 191 00:08:02,023 --> 00:08:03,315 "We are out of here, are leaving." 192 00:08:03,316 --> 00:08:05,109 The hotel itself, a few months later, 193 00:08:05,110 --> 00:08:06,985 actually, a lot of it collapses. 194 00:08:06,986 --> 00:08:09,530 Fortunately, it didn't happen when we were there, 195 00:08:09,531 --> 00:08:11,281 but none of us very surprised 196 00:08:11,282 --> 00:08:13,450 to hear that Broadway Center has collapsed. 197 00:08:13,451 --> 00:08:16,537 My mother finally said, "Okay, we'll stay, 198 00:08:16,538 --> 00:08:18,622 and you can go up to this comic book convention, 199 00:08:18,623 --> 00:08:20,499 but don't touch anything." 200 00:08:20,500 --> 00:08:22,501 And when we pass the bar, 201 00:08:22,502 --> 00:08:24,795 we see Otto Binder sitting there in the bar 202 00:08:24,796 --> 00:08:26,213 with other men drinking. 203 00:08:26,214 --> 00:08:29,091 And we went in and we sat down on the bench. 204 00:08:29,092 --> 00:08:31,343 And he said, "Do you drink?" 205 00:08:31,344 --> 00:08:33,387 We order our Cokes. 206 00:08:33,388 --> 00:08:35,806 And Otto turned to me and Bob, 207 00:08:35,807 --> 00:08:38,642 he said, "Boy, how Will you meet 208 00:08:38,643 --> 00:08:40,811 the creator of Batman?" 209 00:08:40,812 --> 00:08:42,730 And, like, our jaw drops, 210 00:08:42,731 --> 00:08:46,150 Our eyes must be wide open, 211 00:08:46,151 --> 00:08:50,988 and we think we will meet Bob Kane, 212 00:08:50,989 --> 00:08:52,823 which is the only name we have ever seen 213 00:08:52,824 --> 00:08:54,825 in the comic book, it's always in the 214 00:08:54,826 --> 00:08:58,495 box with a big "O" for Bob. 215 00:08:58,496 --> 00:09:02,958 And Otto said, "Friends, meet Bill Finger." 216 00:09:02,959 --> 00:09:07,171 ♪ 217 00:09:07,172 --> 00:09:09,131 So in 1965 at this Comic Con, 218 00:09:09,132 --> 00:09:10,507 in this grim hotel in New York, 219 00:09:10,508 --> 00:09:12,593 Bill Finger makes what might be the first 220 00:09:12,594 --> 00:09:14,636 and maybe the only public appearance, 221 00:09:14,637 --> 00:09:16,013 and he appears in the 222 00:09:16,014 --> 00:09:17,806 panel with the other three comic creators. 223 00:09:17,807 --> 00:09:21,185 In this panel, Bill is introduced 224 00:09:21,186 --> 00:09:23,688 by the moderator name is Jerry Bails. 225 00:09:32,906 --> 00:09:33,906 And maybe we will hear some... 226 00:09:33,907 --> 00:09:37,659 Jerry is a fan, who in 1964 or so, 227 00:09:37,660 --> 00:09:39,453 know it's impossible 228 00:09:39,454 --> 00:09:42,664 only this one person, Bob Kane, writes and draws 229 00:09:42,665 --> 00:09:45,542 every Batman story every month. 230 00:09:45,543 --> 00:09:47,878 So Jerry does some detective work on his own. 231 00:09:47,879 --> 00:09:50,047 He wrote a letter to DC Comics who said, 232 00:09:50,048 --> 00:09:51,215 "Who really did all this?" 233 00:09:51,216 --> 00:09:52,966 And at that time, the company will reply to your letter 234 00:09:52,967 --> 00:09:54,009 with a personal letter. 235 00:09:54,010 --> 00:09:55,886 And the name he saw more than the others 236 00:09:55,887 --> 00:09:57,472 is Bill Finger. 237 00:10:19,327 --> 00:10:22,371 So in 1965, Jerry wrote two-page article 238 00:10:22,372 --> 00:10:24,248 which is called "If the Truth Is Known," 239 00:10:24,249 --> 00:10:25,666 "A Finger in Every Plot!" 240 00:10:25,667 --> 00:10:27,543 And this is very clear long before the internet, 241 00:10:27,544 --> 00:10:29,545 so how to spread the word 242 00:10:29,546 --> 00:10:31,171 does he make a copy of this and send it 243 00:10:31,172 --> 00:10:33,298 for Batman fans all all over the country. 244 00:10:33,299 --> 00:10:36,593 And that's when... 245 00:10:36,594 --> 00:10:38,554 controversy erupted. 246 00:10:38,555 --> 00:10:41,932 Bill is given a forum to tell his story 247 00:10:41,933 --> 00:10:43,851 where we can finally become familiar 248 00:10:43,852 --> 00:10:45,435 with all this characters and books 249 00:10:45,436 --> 00:10:47,229 which he wrote for decades. 250 00:10:47,230 --> 00:10:48,939 That is the first , in writing, 251 00:10:48,940 --> 00:10:50,816 really give Bill Finger credit 252 00:10:50,817 --> 00:10:52,568 for co-creation Batman, 253 00:10:52,569 --> 00:10:55,487 and it's time. 254 00:10:55,488 --> 00:11:00,367 ♪ 255 00:11:00,368 --> 00:11:02,536 decisive Friday in 1939 256 00:11:02,537 --> 00:11:04,621 when Bob told the editor 257 00:11:04,622 --> 00:11:06,707 that he will be able to come with a super hero 258 00:11:06,708 --> 00:11:07,708 over the weekend, 259 00:11:07,709 --> 00:11:09,126 he apparently did it go home that day 260 00:11:09,127 --> 00:11:12,004 and work on a character which he calls "Batman." 261 00:11:12,005 --> 00:11:14,298 Bob's idea for Batman is the character 262 00:11:14,299 --> 00:11:17,384 in red union settings, basically red tights, 263 00:11:17,385 --> 00:11:19,428 domino mask which is a small mask 264 00:11:19,429 --> 00:11:21,805 as Robin used now, 265 00:11:21,806 --> 00:11:24,474 stiff wings attached to the arm, 266 00:11:24,475 --> 00:11:27,394 and, as far as we know, nothing more, 267 00:11:27,395 --> 00:11:30,022 there is nothing else the distinguishing element. 268 00:11:30,023 --> 00:11:31,982 And he knows enough 269 00:11:31,983 --> 00:11:33,942 that this isn't good enough, 270 00:11:33,943 --> 00:11:35,360 and he knows who to contact. 271 00:11:35,361 --> 00:11:38,655 Bill Finger. 272 00:11:38,656 --> 00:11:40,908 They gather together. 273 00:11:40,909 --> 00:11:43,994 They are curled up above this picture, 274 00:11:43,995 --> 00:11:46,330 and Bill looked at red suit and said, 275 00:11:46,331 --> 00:11:49,666 "This is not suitable for night creatures. 276 00:11:49,667 --> 00:11:51,293 He is definitely darker," he said, 277 00:11:51,294 --> 00:11:53,253 "Let's get dark the whole costume." 278 00:11:53,254 --> 00:11:54,713 He looks in that direction the mask is small and says, 279 00:11:54,714 --> 00:11:56,673 "This will not happen intimidate the criminals. 280 00:11:56,674 --> 00:11:58,675 Let's discuss most of the his face with cowl 281 00:11:58,676 --> 00:11:59,843 and put a pointed ear on it, 282 00:11:59,844 --> 00:12:02,554 so he is actually Looks like his name. 283 00:12:02,555 --> 00:12:04,806 Stiff wings is impractical 284 00:12:04,807 --> 00:12:07,184 for obvious reasons, so let's throw away its wings 285 00:12:07,185 --> 00:12:09,728 and give him a robe with a wavy edge 286 00:12:09,729 --> 00:12:11,563 who will fly behind him 287 00:12:11,564 --> 00:12:14,107 and look like wings. " 288 00:12:14,108 --> 00:12:16,652 You set the tone essence of this character 289 00:12:16,653 --> 00:12:18,237 from the visual before you know something 290 00:12:18,238 --> 00:12:20,489 about its personality and its mission. 291 00:12:20,490 --> 00:12:22,824 So that's how Bill is. 292 00:12:22,825 --> 00:12:24,451 Bill reconstructs Batman 293 00:12:24,452 --> 00:12:27,412 into Batman we all know today. 294 00:12:27,413 --> 00:12:28,789 Bob apparently goes to the company 295 00:12:28,790 --> 00:12:30,582 on Monday morning with this sketch. 296 00:12:30,583 --> 00:12:32,960 Doesn't mention it there there are other people involved, 297 00:12:32,961 --> 00:12:36,672 and says, "This is is my idea. " 298 00:12:36,673 --> 00:12:38,966 I have been told, although I have never been included, 299 00:12:38,967 --> 00:12:40,550 of course, for a contract, 300 00:12:40,551 --> 00:12:44,888 that contract is included 301 00:12:44,889 --> 00:12:47,015 special provisions 302 00:12:47,016 --> 00:12:51,603 that Batman will be next registered 303 00:12:51,604 --> 00:12:54,064 as the only Bob Kane creation. 304 00:12:54,065 --> 00:12:56,275 Bob returns to Bill and might say, 305 00:12:56,276 --> 00:12:57,943 "Good news, they want to buy Batman, 306 00:12:57,944 --> 00:13:00,237 so you will write it and I will draw it, 307 00:13:00,238 --> 00:13:01,238 and my name will be in it 308 00:13:01,239 --> 00:13:02,781 because I sell it, of course, 309 00:13:02,782 --> 00:13:04,950 and I will give you a portion of what I paid. " 310 00:13:04,951 --> 00:13:06,576 Nothing was signed, as far as we know, 311 00:13:06,577 --> 00:13:09,788 but that's something they agree together. 312 00:13:09,789 --> 00:13:12,582 So, Bill is not credited at all from the beginning, 313 00:13:12,583 --> 00:13:14,501 and in a few months, 314 00:13:14,502 --> 00:13:16,837 Batman is in newsstands. 315 00:13:16,838 --> 00:13:20,549 ♪ 316 00:13:20,550 --> 00:13:23,343 Batman debuted on & apos; 39 and, basically, 317 00:13:23,344 --> 00:13:27,848 it was from 1939 to 1965 where Bill was anonymous. 318 00:13:27,849 --> 00:13:30,726 That's one thing Bob Kane in 1939 319 00:13:30,727 --> 00:13:33,103 to take full credit for Batman 320 00:13:33,104 --> 00:13:34,771 when Bill Finger agrees, 321 00:13:34,772 --> 00:13:36,523 but where the story changes dramatically 322 00:13:36,524 --> 00:13:39,109 in the 60s when Bill was persuaded out. 323 00:13:39,110 --> 00:13:42,446 At that time, Bob has a decision to make. 324 00:13:42,447 --> 00:13:43,864 "Will I admit this 325 00:13:43,865 --> 00:13:46,616 or I will deny it from my position of strength?" 326 00:13:46,617 --> 00:13:48,785 He has a chance to take, clear, high road 327 00:13:48,786 --> 00:13:49,786 or low road, 328 00:13:49,787 --> 00:13:53,290 and he took the low road. 329 00:13:53,291 --> 00:13:56,626 When Jerry's article about what Bill Finger has done 330 00:13:56,627 --> 00:13:57,836 in Batman coming out, 331 00:13:57,837 --> 00:14:00,297 of course it's made Bob Kane goes ballistic 332 00:14:00,298 --> 00:14:01,882 as soon as he sees it, 333 00:14:01,883 --> 00:14:04,760 so he goes to the editor of Batmania 334 00:14:04,761 --> 00:14:08,638 and he writes half a dozen pages of insults. 335 00:14:08,639 --> 00:14:10,640 Obviously, Bob Kane doesn't want to 336 00:14:10,641 --> 00:14:12,184 Bill Finger's story is told 337 00:14:12,185 --> 00:14:15,479 and take extraordinary offended. 338 00:14:15,480 --> 00:14:17,022 "Here, for the first time, 339 00:14:17,023 --> 00:14:18,732 directly from the horse's mouth, 340 00:14:18,733 --> 00:14:21,860 is the real inner story about me and Batman. 341 00:14:21,861 --> 00:14:23,487 It seems like I Bill Finger 342 00:14:23,488 --> 00:14:26,198 has given the impression that he and not myself 343 00:14:26,199 --> 00:14:28,658 creating & apos; Batman & apos; as well as Robin 344 00:14:28,659 --> 00:14:31,286 and others villains and characters. 345 00:14:31,287 --> 00:14:34,831 This statement is fraudulent and completely untrue! " 346 00:14:34,832 --> 00:14:36,833 There is one man words against the other. 347 00:14:36,834 --> 00:14:38,168 There is no reality show 348 00:14:38,169 --> 00:14:40,754 document the birth of Batman, of course. 349 00:14:40,755 --> 00:14:42,005 That's two people in an apartment 350 00:14:42,006 --> 00:14:44,007 in the Bronx in 1939 when most people had 351 00:14:44,008 --> 00:14:45,509 much bigger things need to worry 352 00:14:45,510 --> 00:14:47,385 from who came this person is dressed like a bat? 353 00:14:47,386 --> 00:14:49,805 "The truth is Bill Fingers take credit 354 00:14:49,806 --> 00:14:51,640 for more than he deserves, 355 00:14:51,641 --> 00:14:54,601 and I refute most of his property the statement here is printed. 356 00:14:54,602 --> 00:14:57,020 The fact is I contain a figure & apos; Batman & apos; 357 00:14:57,021 --> 00:14:59,189 and the costume is entirely alone. 358 00:14:59,190 --> 00:15:01,108 I make titles, mastheads, 359 00:15:01,109 --> 00:15:02,526 formats and concepts, 360 00:15:02,527 --> 00:15:05,153 as well as Batman figures and costumes. " 361 00:15:05,154 --> 00:15:07,489 I don't think so Bob Kane ever wanted it everything is written 362 00:15:07,490 --> 00:15:09,074 it will recognize that other people 363 00:15:09,075 --> 00:15:10,575 have a hand in creating any for Batman. 364 00:15:10,576 --> 00:15:12,577 The whole myth, the contract with DC, 365 00:15:12,578 --> 00:15:15,288 the name in the story all owed to the facts 366 00:15:15,289 --> 00:15:17,874 that he is Batman's creator. 367 00:15:17,875 --> 00:15:20,710 When Bob chooses to respond 368 00:15:20,711 --> 00:15:22,337 for Bill out by writing a letter 369 00:15:22,338 --> 00:15:24,881 370 00:15:24,882 --> 00:15:28,510 reject Bill Engagement to that level, 371 00:15:28,511 --> 00:15:30,846 Bob, basically, changes direction 372 00:15:30,847 --> 00:15:32,389 his life with this letter. 373 00:15:32,390 --> 00:15:34,266 He said, "I must keep 374 00:15:34,267 --> 00:15:36,977 for this story forever." 375 00:15:36,978 --> 00:15:39,688 ♪ 376 00:15:39,689 --> 00:15:42,899 We are all born with natural creative potential. 377 00:15:42,900 --> 00:15:44,943 Everyone has and every woman. 378 00:15:44,944 --> 00:15:47,821 The idea is to find out what it is. 379 00:15:47,822 --> 00:15:50,073 And it's like the little bird tells you 380 00:15:50,074 --> 00:15:52,909 and whisper in your ear, this is intuitive. 381 00:15:52,910 --> 00:15:55,370 No one knows you but God. 382 00:15:55,371 --> 00:15:59,374 And I know I have it when I am eight or ten years old 383 00:15:59,375 --> 00:16:01,626 I want a famous cartoonist. 384 00:16:01,627 --> 00:16:04,546 Bob Kane is still small from the Bronx, 385 00:16:04,547 --> 00:16:08,300 and he is an artist with big dreams. 386 00:16:08,301 --> 00:16:10,260 He is an active person and he is working 387 00:16:10,261 --> 00:16:13,096 for that company will become DC Comics 388 00:16:13,097 --> 00:16:15,932 which at that time was was called National Periodical. 389 00:16:15,933 --> 00:16:18,436 Bob and Bill meet at a party. 390 00:16:20,479 --> 00:16:22,814 They don't know each other before before even though they go to the same high school. 391 00:16:22,815 --> 00:16:25,066 And Bill is a shoe seller. 392 00:16:25,067 --> 00:16:28,028 He has aspirations to become a writer. 393 00:16:28,029 --> 00:16:30,280 I said, "Why don't you try writing 394 00:16:30,281 --> 00:16:31,781 for a new comic book?" 395 00:16:31,782 --> 00:16:33,283 Bob already works in comics, 396 00:16:33,284 --> 00:16:35,577 drawing stories, and Bob can immediately feel 397 00:16:35,578 --> 00:16:37,954 that Bill is good with narration, has a good idea. 398 00:16:37,955 --> 00:16:41,499 Sounds like that 399 00:16:41,500 --> 00:16:42,500 very different types of people, 400 00:16:42,501 --> 00:16:43,710 but I think what they have in common 401 00:16:43,711 --> 00:16:45,295 is their love new comic medium. 402 00:16:45,296 --> 00:16:49,133 403 00:16:51,052 --> 00:16:53,637 In the early days, really, it was Superman 404 00:16:53,638 --> 00:16:56,640 who brings comic book book publishing industry 405 00:16:56,641 --> 00:17:01,311 get out of this mud reprint the comic strip. 406 00:17:01,312 --> 00:17:04,481 That's very much the flying-by-night industry. 407 00:17:04,482 --> 00:17:05,774 You have a comic publisher 408 00:17:05,775 --> 00:17:08,026 who might be a couple people on several tables 409 00:17:08,027 --> 00:17:10,320 in some rooms in Midtown somewhere, 410 00:17:10,321 --> 00:17:12,113 and most of them Do they farm 411 00:17:12,114 --> 00:17:13,823 actual production comic book stories 412 00:17:13,824 --> 00:17:16,034 for what is known as "shop." 413 00:17:16,035 --> 00:17:18,245 You have people just lying under pencil artwork, 414 00:17:18,246 --> 00:17:20,413 You have inkers and finishers which are then placed 415 00:17:20,414 --> 00:17:22,374 permanent artwork above. 416 00:17:22,375 --> 00:17:23,667 There are many people paste, 417 00:17:23,668 --> 00:17:25,168 there are people add word balloons. 418 00:17:25,169 --> 00:17:27,337 Bob Kane and Bill Finger 419 00:17:27,338 --> 00:17:30,006 is, basically, a kind of shop. 420 00:17:30,007 --> 00:17:31,049 Bob is the only 421 00:17:31,050 --> 00:17:32,842 dealing with direct publishers. 422 00:17:32,843 --> 00:17:35,887 Kane has his name Batman story, 423 00:17:35,888 --> 00:17:38,014 but he doesn't tell anyone about Bill Finger, 424 00:17:38,015 --> 00:17:39,432 and, of course, you assume 425 00:17:39,433 --> 00:17:42,894 which he has done in outline, 426 00:17:42,895 --> 00:17:44,896 and I think it's fair the way Bob wants it. 427 00:17:44,897 --> 00:17:47,399 From a company point of view, 428 00:17:47,400 --> 00:17:48,692 they contract Bob Kane, 429 00:17:48,693 --> 00:17:50,986 Bob Kane should send the page to them, 430 00:17:50,987 --> 00:17:52,112 and that's all they care about. 431 00:17:52,113 --> 00:17:54,114 They go, "I don't care how you build it," 432 00:17:54,115 --> 00:17:56,199 true, only, "I need it built every 30 days 433 00:17:56,200 --> 00:17:58,868 because we have publishing deadlines come here." 434 00:17:58,869 --> 00:18:01,079 So to fulfill its demands 435 00:18:01,080 --> 00:18:03,415 from a hungry audience and feed the machine 436 00:18:03,416 --> 00:18:05,166 and get money by doing it 437 00:18:05,167 --> 00:18:07,419 because many different Batman titles might, 438 00:18:07,420 --> 00:18:09,838 they will hire ghosts writers back that day. 439 00:18:09,839 --> 00:18:11,381 Bob Kane will get it credit for the story. 440 00:18:11,382 --> 00:18:13,133 He handed it over, "This is my Batman story." 441 00:18:13,134 --> 00:18:14,259 They are like, "Bob, you're a genius," 442 00:18:14,260 --> 00:18:15,844 and, you know, that's how the industry works 443 00:18:15,845 --> 00:18:17,262 for a very long time. 444 00:18:17,263 --> 00:18:19,347 Most ghost artists or ghost writers 445 00:18:19,348 --> 00:18:22,058 is there only for run vision 446 00:18:22,059 --> 00:18:24,811 or work instructions from the people who employ them. 447 00:18:24,812 --> 00:18:28,064 They are not there to sort from making new concepts. 448 00:18:28,065 --> 00:18:31,901 But because Bill Finger is there at the beginning, 449 00:18:31,902 --> 00:18:33,903 he is not just a ghost writer. 450 00:18:33,904 --> 00:18:37,407 He is not only the man who was brought later 451 00:18:37,408 --> 00:18:40,410 when Batman is already there run and succeed 452 00:18:40,411 --> 00:18:43,246 and all figures of speech are in place. 453 00:18:43,247 --> 00:18:46,916 Bill Finger basically creates all these figures, 454 00:18:46,917 --> 00:18:51,504 but in the actual work hierarchy 455 00:18:51,505 --> 00:18:54,175 only as a ghost writer. 456 00:18:56,177 --> 00:18:58,136 (birdsong) 457 00:18:58,137 --> 00:19:01,348 I have never done research someone so far. 458 00:19:01,349 --> 00:19:03,933 I mean, this becomes search like that, 459 00:19:03,934 --> 00:19:05,060 and there seems to be 460 00:19:05,061 --> 00:19:07,979 higher moral obligation for this. 461 00:19:07,980 --> 00:19:11,441 You know, this is 700 pages information about a subject 462 00:19:11,442 --> 00:19:12,817 what some of my people say at the beginning, 463 00:19:12,818 --> 00:19:14,736 "There's nothing more important learn about Bill Finger." 464 00:19:14,737 --> 00:19:17,364 I feel this calling to do this. 465 00:19:17,365 --> 00:19:18,448 Especially with something like 466 00:19:18,449 --> 00:19:19,949 phenomenal success as Batman, 467 00:19:19,950 --> 00:19:23,370 how could this not happen already so famous? 468 00:19:23,371 --> 00:19:25,955 First panel Batman's first story, 469 00:19:25,956 --> 00:19:27,457 just prepare this mysterious, 470 00:19:27,458 --> 00:19:29,292 premonition character says, 471 00:19:29,293 --> 00:19:31,920 "The identity is still unknown." 472 00:19:31,921 --> 00:19:34,339 Obviously Bill writes about Batman, 473 00:19:34,340 --> 00:19:36,257 but it ends with prophesying 474 00:19:36,258 --> 00:19:39,886 because of Bill first Batman's secret identity. 475 00:19:39,887 --> 00:19:42,722 When I started research about this project, 476 00:19:42,723 --> 00:19:44,849 there are only two photos known 477 00:19:44,850 --> 00:19:46,267 Bill circulates. 478 00:19:46,268 --> 00:19:48,812 It was with baseball caps on the profile 479 00:19:48,813 --> 00:19:53,650 or he plays golf, half in shadow and not that close. 480 00:19:53,651 --> 00:19:56,319 From seven sources over nine months, 481 00:19:56,320 --> 00:19:59,781 I finally found 11 more photos of Bill. 482 00:19:59,782 --> 00:20:02,242 He was interviewed only a few times, 483 00:20:02,243 --> 00:20:03,952 be for a man from the impact of Bill 484 00:20:03,953 --> 00:20:06,538 only have a few of these interview records 485 00:20:06,539 --> 00:20:08,164 in its existence is only surprising, 486 00:20:08,165 --> 00:20:12,168 to be the first time Jerry Bail in 1965 487 00:20:12,169 --> 00:20:16,339 and then for 1970 the book History of Comics. 488 00:20:16,340 --> 00:20:18,633 And it turns out in 1972, 489 00:20:18,634 --> 00:20:21,553 a man in California named Robert Porfirio 490 00:20:21,554 --> 00:20:23,680 interview Bill on audio. 491 00:20:23,681 --> 00:20:25,014 It took a while, but finally 492 00:20:25,015 --> 00:20:27,475 we actually found this audio recording... 493 00:20:27,476 --> 00:20:30,061 Testing, one... do you want say something, or...? 494 00:20:30,062 --> 00:20:31,229 Yes, of course. 495 00:20:31,230 --> 00:20:33,022 How are you? 496 00:20:33,023 --> 00:20:37,026 ... which is one of them more emotional moments 497 00:20:37,027 --> 00:20:38,153 I will say, for me, because of that 498 00:20:38,154 --> 00:20:40,364 the first time I heard Bill's voice. 499 00:21:07,057 --> 00:21:08,057 To write this book, 500 00:21:08,058 --> 00:21:10,810 I speak with more than 250 people. 501 00:21:10,811 --> 00:21:14,606 Of that amount, a handful, maybe a dozen, 502 00:21:14,607 --> 00:21:17,317 know both Bill and Bob personally. 503 00:21:17,318 --> 00:21:20,195 Two of the creators are very helpful and have an impact on this process is Jerry Robinson, 504 00:21:20,196 --> 00:21:23,782 one of the earliest ghost artists Batman, 505 00:21:23,783 --> 00:21:25,950 and Carmine Infantino. 506 00:21:25,951 --> 00:21:27,577 He is an artist who has been redefined 507 00:21:27,578 --> 00:21:29,370 Batman's appearance in the 60s, 508 00:21:29,371 --> 00:21:30,872 and Carmine continue to become publishers 509 00:21:30,873 --> 00:21:32,791 DC comics for time in the 70s. 510 00:21:32,792 --> 00:21:35,877 He's a genius, really a genius. 511 00:21:35,878 --> 00:21:38,046 I believe that. 512 00:21:38,047 --> 00:21:39,714 I know Bob tries to take credit for all. 513 00:21:39,715 --> 00:21:41,925 He should be credited as co-creator of Batman. 514 00:21:41,926 --> 00:21:46,304 He said, "I want to get some ownership." 515 00:21:46,305 --> 00:21:48,681 516 00:21:48,682 --> 00:21:50,016 No, he didn't say, he said, "I want to get it 517 00:21:50,017 --> 00:21:53,019 that piece because I did it." 518 00:21:53,020 --> 00:21:56,064 So, but then he said, "I can't pay a lawyer, 519 00:21:56,065 --> 00:21:58,650 and they know that," quote, "They know that." 520 00:21:58,651 --> 00:22:02,737 They tell me, you know, is uncertain, 521 00:22:02,738 --> 00:22:03,822 they think Bill Finger 522 00:22:03,823 --> 00:22:05,782 deprived of his inheritance. 523 00:22:05,783 --> 00:22:08,451 She is Batman, Bill. 524 00:22:08,452 --> 00:22:11,037 Everything you think is good, that's Bill. 525 00:22:11,038 --> 00:22:12,789 They take their humanity 526 00:22:12,790 --> 00:22:14,958 when you take their credit. 527 00:22:14,959 --> 00:22:16,459 Basically both of them say, 528 00:22:16,460 --> 00:22:18,294 "Without Bill, won't have Batman." 529 00:22:18,295 --> 00:22:20,046 It's that simple. 530 00:22:20,047 --> 00:22:22,799 And that's because Bill does the following: 531 00:22:22,800 --> 00:22:25,593 Bill Finger is dominant creative power 532 00:22:25,594 --> 00:22:28,429 and original author of Batman, 533 00:22:28,430 --> 00:22:31,975 Robin, the Joker, Catwoman, Riddler, 534 00:22:31,976 --> 00:22:34,269 Penguins, scarecrows, 535 00:22:34,270 --> 00:22:36,980 Commissioner Gordon, Bruce Wayne, and Dick Grayson. 536 00:22:36,981 --> 00:22:38,690 He named Gotham City. 537 00:22:38,691 --> 00:22:40,900 He was nicknamed Batman "Dark Knight." 538 00:22:40,901 --> 00:22:42,986 He is the first person to write a story 539 00:22:42,987 --> 00:22:44,571 with Batmobile and Batcave 540 00:22:44,572 --> 00:22:45,989 call those things. 541 00:22:45,990 --> 00:22:47,782 He wrote from Batman. 542 00:22:47,783 --> 00:22:50,660 That's just two pages stories, but it's seismic. 543 00:22:50,661 --> 00:22:53,538 This eight-year-old boy saw his parents killed 544 00:22:53,539 --> 00:22:55,123 right before his eyes and swear 545 00:22:55,124 --> 00:22:58,877 that he won't let this happen to other people. 546 00:22:58,878 --> 00:23:01,170 I mean, the man builds this world. 547 00:23:01,171 --> 00:23:04,215 He keeps what he calls "a gimmick book." 548 00:23:04,216 --> 00:23:05,717 He will fill it with the story idea, 549 00:23:05,718 --> 00:23:07,302 and he will do it sometimes take a bus 550 00:23:07,303 --> 00:23:09,012 around the city to get inspiration. 551 00:23:09,013 --> 00:23:11,097 He will only notate and only be an observer. 552 00:23:11,098 --> 00:23:13,349 He will do many things research for scripts. 553 00:23:13,350 --> 00:23:15,518 He will attach clippings to the artists 554 00:23:15,519 --> 00:23:17,186 so they will do it have references. 555 00:23:17,187 --> 00:23:18,646 He thinks very visually. 556 00:23:18,647 --> 00:23:19,772 He thinks cinematically. 557 00:23:19,773 --> 00:23:23,026 He will write this big and epic scenes. 558 00:23:23,027 --> 00:23:25,403 One of those things he is famous for 559 00:23:25,404 --> 00:23:27,864 is writing stories with big props, 560 00:23:27,865 --> 00:23:29,991 so Batman and Robin fight above 561 00:23:29,992 --> 00:23:32,076 from a giant typewriter with some criminals, 562 00:23:32,077 --> 00:23:33,828 and these items are just very pleasant and inventive to see. 563 00:23:33,829 --> 00:23:35,038 He has a hero who looks like a villain. 564 00:23:35,039 --> 00:23:38,082 He has a super hero who is also a detective. 565 00:23:38,083 --> 00:23:40,960 566 00:23:40,961 --> 00:23:43,046 He's smart, he's not only using muscles, 567 00:23:43,047 --> 00:23:44,631 he also uses the brain. 568 00:23:44,632 --> 00:23:47,050 Bill takes all this and put it in a container 569 00:23:47,051 --> 00:23:48,134 and mix it together 570 00:23:48,135 --> 00:23:51,262 and bring this a deeper understanding of the story 571 00:23:51,263 --> 00:23:55,224 until then was considered to be rather reckless. 572 00:23:55,225 --> 00:23:57,310 Aspects of characters, humans, 573 00:23:57,311 --> 00:23:59,395 that Bill brought, like that idea 574 00:23:59,396 --> 00:24:01,731 a small child in a city with his parents who was shot dead, and at a young age, 575 00:24:01,732 --> 00:24:03,983 that he will bring with him 576 00:24:03,984 --> 00:24:05,568 for the rest of his life. 577 00:24:05,569 --> 00:24:07,362 And the man is only a human 578 00:24:07,363 --> 00:24:09,489 who is just a man. 579 00:24:09,490 --> 00:24:10,615 That's all, it doesn't have super strength. 580 00:24:10,616 --> 00:24:12,158 He has some pretty good things 581 00:24:12,159 --> 00:24:13,368 in his belt and things, but he is endlessly. 582 00:24:13,369 --> 00:24:16,162 583 00:24:16,163 --> 00:24:17,830 He is a passionate creature. 584 00:24:17,831 --> 00:24:20,416 That character kind of makes you reach. 585 00:24:20,417 --> 00:24:21,751 That's the character built by people 586 00:24:21,752 --> 00:24:25,546 their moral compass above, or, "That's my guy." 587 00:24:25,547 --> 00:24:28,633 That's what makes it Batman is so beautiful. 588 00:24:28,634 --> 00:24:32,095 You don't get there without Bill Finger, friend. 589 00:24:32,096 --> 00:24:34,597 ♪ 590 00:24:34,598 --> 00:24:36,557 ♪ Batman ♪♪ 591 00:24:36,558 --> 00:24:38,101 Sunday after week, Sized Crusaders 592 00:24:38,102 --> 00:24:41,020 trying with complicated ones traps of fierce criminals. 593 00:24:41,021 --> 00:24:42,814 ♪ 594 00:24:42,815 --> 00:24:44,607 Cultural penetration, 595 00:24:44,608 --> 00:24:47,318 and only in the ranking book, 596 00:24:47,319 --> 00:24:50,989 is Batman 1966 television series. 597 00:24:50,990 --> 00:24:52,198 See Dynamic Duo 598 00:24:52,199 --> 00:24:54,200 dangling from new height of danger. 599 00:24:54,201 --> 00:24:56,160 Be careful, Robin, that's quite a drop. 600 00:24:56,161 --> 00:24:57,870 This is not dark and serious 601 00:24:57,871 --> 00:24:59,038 Night creatures 602 00:24:59,039 --> 00:25:01,708 as made by Bob Kane and Bill Finger. 603 00:25:01,709 --> 00:25:04,836 That causes excitement in what was originally 604 00:25:04,837 --> 00:25:08,172 phase of pop art American culture. 605 00:25:08,173 --> 00:25:10,633 Together with Batman and Robin twice a week 606 00:25:10,634 --> 00:25:13,219 in color, of course, on ABC. 607 00:25:13,220 --> 00:25:17,140 ♪ 608 00:25:17,141 --> 00:25:21,310 Starting with the debut of Batman TV show in 1966, 609 00:25:21,311 --> 00:25:24,063 Bill and Bob trajectories deviate 610 00:25:24,064 --> 00:25:26,607 even clearer than before. 611 00:25:26,608 --> 00:25:28,818 You know, Bob first just went up, up, up, 612 00:25:28,819 --> 00:25:30,945 and Bill really fell. 613 00:25:30,946 --> 00:25:33,865 TV shows change Bob's life is very dramatic because that's where he gets big payments for Batman 614 00:25:33,866 --> 00:25:36,951 which makes it rich. 615 00:25:36,952 --> 00:25:38,828 You stopped drawing comic books in the 60s, 616 00:25:38,829 --> 00:25:43,750 and what happens, do do you sell the rights? 617 00:25:43,751 --> 00:25:46,669 618 00:25:46,670 --> 00:25:49,130 No, it's not that, when I stop drawing, 619 00:25:49,131 --> 00:25:50,923 I have never sold all rights. 620 00:25:50,924 --> 00:25:53,509 I have a piece of Batman. 621 00:25:53,510 --> 00:25:55,011 So you still... 622 00:25:55,012 --> 00:25:57,180 Do you still have copyright on Batman? 623 00:25:57,181 --> 00:25:59,849 Well, everyone wants to know that, right? 624 00:25:59,850 --> 00:26:02,727 I will let you know... I will let you know. 625 00:26:02,728 --> 00:26:05,146 I have answered it before, that piece. 626 00:26:05,147 --> 00:26:06,564 Just a piece, okay. 627 00:26:06,565 --> 00:26:08,066 That's a cake. 628 00:26:08,067 --> 00:26:10,401 This is the cut cake. 629 00:26:10,402 --> 00:26:11,944 (chuckles) 630 00:26:11,945 --> 00:26:15,573 After the Batman TV show, Bob is able to risk it 631 00:26:15,574 --> 00:26:18,201 in some degree of celebrity 632 00:26:18,202 --> 00:26:19,869 without being directly involved. 633 00:26:19,870 --> 00:26:22,205 He is in full peacock mode 634 00:26:22,206 --> 00:26:26,876 presents itself as Batman's real life Alter. 635 00:26:26,877 --> 00:26:28,377 He wants to be famous, isn't he? 636 00:26:28,378 --> 00:26:31,714 I mean, that's weird because most people are creative 637 00:26:31,715 --> 00:26:33,841 in our industry only... they do it 638 00:26:33,842 --> 00:26:35,259 for creative reasons 639 00:26:35,260 --> 00:26:37,804 because they are only maniac artists. 640 00:26:37,805 --> 00:26:39,555 But I understand out of Mr. Kane, 641 00:26:39,556 --> 00:26:43,476 it's like a plan and, "Oh, I have to make the artwork 642 00:26:43,477 --> 00:26:45,144 to get a quasi-celebrity," 643 00:26:45,145 --> 00:26:47,021 that kind of thing reverse engineering 644 00:26:47,022 --> 00:26:48,231 from what most of us do. 645 00:26:48,232 --> 00:26:49,941 We just go, "We do art, and oh, by the way, 646 00:26:49,942 --> 00:26:52,026 people think we are famous, oh, cool." 647 00:26:52,027 --> 00:26:55,780 And then I started Batman oil painting 648 00:26:55,781 --> 00:26:57,824 and I have another non-Batman art, 649 00:26:57,825 --> 00:27:00,326 and I already have a lot of shows the world with my art. 650 00:27:00,327 --> 00:27:05,206 So he started doing Batman's lithograph series, 651 00:27:05,207 --> 00:27:08,251 and he encouraged this litos as his own, 652 00:27:08,252 --> 00:27:11,879 and, again, he has another ghost artist who actually actually is doing this lithograph. 653 00:27:11,880 --> 00:27:15,216 Bob makes his career 654 00:27:15,217 --> 00:27:17,802 by having another people doing work 655 00:27:17,803 --> 00:27:19,846 and put the name there. 656 00:27:19,847 --> 00:27:21,139 That is hers... That is the strategy. 657 00:27:21,140 --> 00:27:23,933 That is a photo of Bob Kane 658 00:27:23,934 --> 00:27:25,476 You see in magazines and newspapers. 659 00:27:25,477 --> 00:27:27,311 That's about Bob Kane show art gallery. 660 00:27:27,312 --> 00:27:30,898 Bob becomes one from the first time 661 00:27:30,899 --> 00:27:33,442 comic book celebrities. 662 00:27:33,443 --> 00:27:35,112 Batman's TV program almost nothing for Bill. 663 00:27:36,655 --> 00:27:40,324 Significance 664 00:27:40,325 --> 00:27:41,576 that Bill is only the writer of comics 665 00:27:41,577 --> 00:27:43,536 who writes an episode of from a TV program. 666 00:27:43,537 --> 00:27:45,621 Actually, Batman shows that he co-wrote 667 00:27:45,622 --> 00:27:47,373 with her friend named Charles Sinclair 668 00:27:47,374 --> 00:27:49,333 is hers publish Batman credit. 669 00:27:49,334 --> 00:27:53,296 670 00:27:53,297 --> 00:27:56,382 We do Batman TV, 671 00:27:56,383 --> 00:27:59,760 and "The Clock King & apos; s Crazy Crime," 672 00:27:59,761 --> 00:28:01,137 Thank you very much. 673 00:28:01,138 --> 00:28:04,432 And Bill thinks about it all kinds of gimmicks 674 00:28:04,433 --> 00:28:07,560 for hours and times. 675 00:28:07,561 --> 00:28:09,645 When we get confirmation 676 00:28:09,646 --> 00:28:12,982 that we have sold to Batman, 677 00:28:12,983 --> 00:28:16,569 Bill is rather digging his toes in the sand 678 00:28:16,570 --> 00:28:18,154 and hemming and hawing, 679 00:28:18,155 --> 00:28:20,281 and I know he has something in his mind. 680 00:28:20,282 --> 00:28:21,490 Finally, I said, "Come on, Bill, 681 00:28:21,491 --> 00:28:22,658 what is in your mind? 682 00:28:22,659 --> 00:28:24,368 Something is eating you. 683 00:28:24,369 --> 00:28:27,204 What is it and how do I do it Can I help you?" 684 00:28:27,205 --> 00:28:31,959 Well, it is billing on the show. 685 00:28:31,960 --> 00:28:37,381 Bill said, "Could I just this get the top bill once?" 686 00:28:37,382 --> 00:28:41,344 I say, "Sure, why not?" 687 00:28:41,345 --> 00:28:45,014 Bill Finger, at that time, 688 00:28:45,015 --> 00:28:48,726 have a little black and white TV. 689 00:28:48,727 --> 00:28:51,604 I said, "Bill, you already have to see this object 690 00:28:51,605 --> 00:28:53,731 in color," you know. 691 00:28:53,732 --> 00:28:55,858 So I called a friend on ABC, 692 00:28:55,859 --> 00:29:02,573 and we go and sit in client's viewpoint... 693 00:29:02,574 --> 00:29:04,992 and see this Batman object, 694 00:29:04,993 --> 00:29:09,538 Bill and me, on large color sets. 695 00:29:09,539 --> 00:29:12,291 Bill first was struck by lightning, you know? 696 00:29:12,292 --> 00:29:16,045 I don't know if he actually has tears 697 00:29:16,046 --> 00:29:17,380 run down cheeks, you know, 698 00:29:17,381 --> 00:29:20,383 but I think he is close enough. 699 00:29:20,384 --> 00:29:24,470 Bang, he saw his name, You know, top billing 700 00:29:24,471 --> 00:29:27,139 colored on a large TV screen. 701 00:29:27,140 --> 00:29:29,308 I mean, this is like a high point 702 00:29:29,309 --> 00:29:31,519 creative life. 703 00:29:31,520 --> 00:29:36,899 ♪ 704 00:29:36,900 --> 00:29:39,527 Most writers of Golden Age 705 00:29:39,528 --> 00:29:41,445 starts to be deleted 706 00:29:41,446 --> 00:29:44,281 in the middle and the last 60s in DC. 707 00:29:44,282 --> 00:29:46,826 A new era of talent comes, 708 00:29:46,827 --> 00:29:48,119 fans who become 709 00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:50,079 new comic book writer, 710 00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:51,998 new comic book artists, 711 00:29:51,999 --> 00:29:55,084 and people from the original generation is finding it harder and harder 712 00:29:55,085 --> 00:29:57,169 and more difficult to adapt. 713 00:29:57,170 --> 00:29:59,088 The company said, "Just because they have 714 00:29:59,089 --> 00:30:01,257 co-made or written this characters go back to & apos; 40s, 715 00:30:01,258 --> 00:30:03,968 we need fresh young blood." 716 00:30:03,969 --> 00:30:05,428 Who cares if Bill Finger writes Batman? 717 00:30:05,429 --> 00:30:07,763 There seems to be lack of respect 718 00:30:07,764 --> 00:30:10,099 for the work body. 719 00:30:10,100 --> 00:30:11,434 I mean, that's how some people will interpret it. 720 00:30:11,435 --> 00:30:13,436 This is not just a man who creates characters 721 00:30:13,437 --> 00:30:15,271 which we have used several times. 722 00:30:15,272 --> 00:30:16,689 This is a man who creates the whole world 723 00:30:16,690 --> 00:30:18,482 that we are red to the bone. 724 00:30:18,483 --> 00:30:21,318 725 00:30:21,319 --> 00:30:24,071 So I can't imagine what he feels. 726 00:30:24,072 --> 00:30:25,823 He spent the rest of the from writings in the 60s, 727 00:30:25,824 --> 00:30:28,951 but not Batman, even comics. 728 00:30:28,952 --> 00:30:31,120 He writes carpentry articles, 729 00:30:31,121 --> 00:30:34,290 he finally wrote to Army Pictorial Center. 730 00:30:34,291 --> 00:30:36,751 So he always fighting for money. 731 00:30:36,752 --> 00:30:38,169 He is under pressure, 732 00:30:38,170 --> 00:30:42,131 I think he economizes on drugs. 733 00:30:42,132 --> 00:30:45,634 I don't think he eats well, 734 00:30:45,635 --> 00:30:46,677 and he slides, 735 00:30:46,678 --> 00:30:48,763 and I can't do it too much about that. 736 00:30:48,764 --> 00:30:51,891 He just passed and worked hard 737 00:30:51,892 --> 00:30:54,101 and pay attention to it characters become bigger 738 00:30:54,102 --> 00:30:57,021 than before and become more separate from it 739 00:30:57,022 --> 00:30:58,148 than before. 740 00:30:59,900 --> 00:31:01,817 My first comic convention 741 00:31:01,818 --> 00:31:05,154 is New York City 1973 742 00:31:05,155 --> 00:31:08,699 4th of July Com Convention at the Commodore Hotel, 743 00:31:08,700 --> 00:31:10,993 and the main speaker of the convention 744 00:31:10,994 --> 00:31:13,704 is Bob Kane, and I am a Batman fan! 745 00:31:13,705 --> 00:31:16,040 And I remember standing behind 746 00:31:16,041 --> 00:31:18,501 from this packed ballroom 747 00:31:18,502 --> 00:31:20,211 where is Bob Kane a little spotting 748 00:31:20,212 --> 00:31:22,171 in the distance on the stage. 749 00:31:22,172 --> 00:31:24,673 But what do I remember hearing? 750 00:31:24,674 --> 00:31:26,717 "I created Batman, I created Robin, 751 00:31:26,718 --> 00:31:28,719 I created the Joker, I made..." 752 00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:32,848 "I, me, me, me, me..." that is what I remember. 753 00:31:32,849 --> 00:31:35,976 And the problem is that we don't know at the time, 754 00:31:35,977 --> 00:31:37,895 but Bill Finger is still alive 755 00:31:37,896 --> 00:31:41,357 in the summer 73 73, maybe on the last leg. 756 00:31:41,358 --> 00:31:44,568 So what really annoys me about Bob Kane 757 00:31:44,569 --> 00:31:47,571 is it up to Bill Finger's time died, 758 00:31:47,572 --> 00:31:50,699 friends and partners who helped create Batman, 759 00:31:50,700 --> 00:31:53,744 which gives Bob Kane a life and fame 760 00:31:53,745 --> 00:31:55,037 for the rest of his life, 761 00:31:55,038 --> 00:31:59,875 he is left to die has no money and is unknown. 762 00:31:59,876 --> 00:32:01,627 And for that, there there is no forgiveness 763 00:32:01,628 --> 00:32:04,255 for Bob Kane. 764 00:32:04,256 --> 00:32:07,133 In the early 70s, Bill began writing 765 00:32:07,134 --> 00:32:08,717 for comics again and for DC. 766 00:32:08,718 --> 00:32:10,469 He starts writing a mystery story, 767 00:32:10,470 --> 00:32:13,222 and he has two stories on Friday, 768 00:32:13,223 --> 00:32:15,599 he just handed it one and went home, 769 00:32:15,600 --> 00:32:18,561 seems to be finished second. 770 00:32:18,562 --> 00:32:22,231 This is January 18, 1974 He lives alone in Manhattan 771 00:32:22,232 --> 00:32:24,400 in a small apartment 772 00:32:24,401 --> 00:32:25,609 in the same building as Charles. 773 00:32:25,610 --> 00:32:27,737 On this special day, I haven't heard from Bill 774 00:32:29,489 --> 00:32:32,074 for several days, 775 00:32:32,075 --> 00:32:34,910 and I carry a duplicate key 776 00:32:34,911 --> 00:32:38,747 for his apartment. 777 00:32:38,748 --> 00:32:41,667 I go to the apartment, 778 00:32:41,668 --> 00:32:44,211 779 00:32:44,212 --> 00:32:46,213 and he is behind in the rent. 780 00:32:46,214 --> 00:32:50,593 The owner has expelled notification on the door. 781 00:32:50,594 --> 00:32:53,012 I use my key and enter. 782 00:32:53,013 --> 00:32:55,139 ♪ 783 00:32:55,140 --> 00:32:58,267 I walked over to him. 784 00:32:58,268 --> 00:33:02,479 He has a blanket like stop here. 785 00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:05,107 I pulled it down. 786 00:33:05,108 --> 00:33:07,985 Look, see, and see, you know. 787 00:33:07,986 --> 00:33:10,446 No movement, nothing, you know? 788 00:33:10,447 --> 00:33:14,617 And I reached out, shook his shoulder. 789 00:33:14,618 --> 00:33:17,328 None. 790 00:33:17,329 --> 00:33:20,915 Poor Bill has died alone 791 00:33:20,916 --> 00:33:24,210 with little television is in progress. 792 00:33:24,211 --> 00:33:26,128 I think, you know, what... 793 00:33:26,129 --> 00:33:30,174 sort of a sad little ending. 794 00:33:30,175 --> 00:33:34,345 ♪ 795 00:33:34,346 --> 00:33:37,890 The world has lost one very attractive man. 796 00:33:37,891 --> 00:33:42,102 ♪ 797 00:33:42,103 --> 00:33:43,979 So when I ask Charles 798 00:33:43,980 --> 00:33:46,148 "What happened to Bill after he died?" 799 00:33:46,149 --> 00:33:48,400 Charles said, "Marc, I don't think 800 00:33:48,401 --> 00:33:51,362 we want to talk about that." 801 00:33:51,363 --> 00:33:54,198 And I said, "You might be right. 802 00:33:54,199 --> 00:33:57,243 I know this is difficult, but I have to ask." 803 00:33:57,244 --> 00:33:58,661 And then Charles says that he thinks 804 00:33:58,662 --> 00:34:02,873 that Bill is buried in the pottery field. 805 00:34:02,874 --> 00:34:06,502 These are graves unmarked graves. 806 00:34:06,503 --> 00:34:07,628 People who don't have someone 807 00:34:07,629 --> 00:34:09,338 to care for them. 808 00:34:09,339 --> 00:34:12,174 Homeless people... I mean , it's hopeless, 809 00:34:12,175 --> 00:34:14,843 very sad. 810 00:34:14,844 --> 00:34:17,388 Medical report examiner says, 811 00:34:17,389 --> 00:34:21,392 "natural causes, no family, no history," 812 00:34:21,393 --> 00:34:22,768 which of course refers to 813 00:34:22,769 --> 00:34:25,020 for medical history, 814 00:34:25,021 --> 00:34:28,107 but when you read the now, textually, 815 00:34:28,108 --> 00:34:30,693 it's scary because this medical examiner 816 00:34:30,694 --> 00:34:34,613 do not know at all significant history 817 00:34:34,614 --> 00:34:37,157 this man has. 818 00:34:37,158 --> 00:34:39,576 So when I hear the , I just think, 819 00:34:39,577 --> 00:34:40,786 You know, only at the human level 820 00:34:40,787 --> 00:34:43,414 we have to do something for this man. 821 00:34:43,415 --> 00:34:45,624 There are so many fans who climb 822 00:34:45,625 --> 00:34:47,543 for justice for the creators. 823 00:34:47,544 --> 00:34:48,752 I think in the end it takes more 824 00:34:48,753 --> 00:34:50,838 from this amorphous mass of fans. 825 00:34:50,839 --> 00:34:53,549 There must be one person who moves 826 00:34:53,550 --> 00:34:55,342 and lead costs. 827 00:34:55,343 --> 00:34:57,303 ♪ 828 00:34:57,304 --> 00:34:58,971 When I started this project, 829 00:34:58,972 --> 00:35:00,681 I have become a published author. 830 00:35:00,682 --> 00:35:02,975 I want to tell other good stories. 831 00:35:02,976 --> 00:35:04,393 And then when I study 832 00:35:04,394 --> 00:35:06,895 how much should be done reveal about Bill's life 833 00:35:06,896 --> 00:35:10,566 and how much more we can do in its name, 834 00:35:10,567 --> 00:35:14,570 it becomes not only a book but a crusade. 835 00:35:14,571 --> 00:35:17,740 My goal starts developing Bill's name in Batman, 836 00:35:17,741 --> 00:35:20,868 to get this man as a credit that will never be lost, 837 00:35:20,869 --> 00:35:23,579 that will hang all of this. 838 00:35:23,580 --> 00:35:25,205 I have a partner people who say, 839 00:35:25,206 --> 00:35:27,708 "What you are trying to do" will never happen. ? 840 00:35:27,709 --> 00:35:29,752 Will there be one person about it? " 841 00:35:29,753 --> 00:35:32,713 And I say to myself, "I have no idea, 842 00:35:32,714 --> 00:35:34,757 but I will try." 843 00:35:34,758 --> 00:35:36,800 (wind blowing) 844 00:35:36,801 --> 00:35:39,136 Here it is, Poe Park. 845 00:35:39,137 --> 00:35:41,430 So this is Poe Park in the Bronx. 846 00:35:41,431 --> 00:35:44,351 847 00:35:49,606 --> 00:35:52,734 848 00:35:53,943 --> 00:35:55,819 849 00:35:55,820 --> 00:35:57,946 This is where Bill and Bob will come 850 00:35:57,947 --> 00:35:59,531 and exchange ideas ideas for stories. 851 00:35:59,532 --> 00:36:01,408 They will sit Park benches here 852 00:36:01,409 --> 00:36:02,868 and discuss Batman. 853 00:36:02,869 --> 00:36:04,495 I don't know that I will do 854 00:36:04,496 --> 00:36:05,788 this kind of excavation. 855 00:36:05,789 --> 00:36:08,165 This is the apartment where Bill lives 856 00:36:08,166 --> 00:36:11,502 in 1965 when he was interviewed by Jerry Bails. 857 00:36:11,503 --> 00:36:14,630 He is also very good, and he wants, you know, 858 00:36:14,631 --> 00:36:17,424 he wants to do right in the world, 859 00:36:17,425 --> 00:36:18,759 and he is encouraged. 860 00:36:18,760 --> 00:36:21,136 Bill Finger is co-creator of Batman. 861 00:36:21,137 --> 00:36:23,764 And I am very sure that he lives here 862 00:36:23,765 --> 00:36:25,182 at that time he created Batman, 863 00:36:25,183 --> 00:36:27,893 so I think he lives in one of these three units, 864 00:36:27,894 --> 00:36:28,977 and I want to look into 865 00:36:28,978 --> 00:36:30,145 if you can show it. 866 00:36:30,146 --> 00:36:31,689 The parallel isn't lost to me 867 00:36:31,690 --> 00:36:33,899 made by Bill Batman detective, 868 00:36:33,900 --> 00:36:36,485 and I am a detective in pursuing Bill's legacy. 869 00:36:36,486 --> 00:36:38,195 That's the fun part of it. 870 00:36:38,196 --> 00:36:39,822 How did you find this? 871 00:36:39,823 --> 00:36:41,073 I did a lot of research. 872 00:36:41,074 --> 00:36:43,992 I really went the New York City 873 00:36:43,993 --> 00:36:48,706 phonebook every year from 1930 to 1974 I look for my guy, 874 00:36:48,707 --> 00:36:50,582 and this is where it starts. 875 00:36:50,583 --> 00:36:51,959 It becomes addictive. 876 00:36:51,960 --> 00:36:53,919 I feel like, if I find this great thing 877 00:36:53,920 --> 00:36:56,547 it's unknown, there may be more. 878 00:36:56,548 --> 00:36:59,633 ♪ 879 00:36:59,634 --> 00:37:02,469 When I start research, we know this much: 880 00:37:02,470 --> 00:37:04,304 Wife Bill named Portia, 881 00:37:04,305 --> 00:37:07,015 they are married sometimes in the 1940s. 882 00:37:07,016 --> 00:37:08,684 I believe that they messy marriage 883 00:37:08,685 --> 00:37:10,477 in the 50s. 884 00:37:10,478 --> 00:37:13,689 To try legally credit line contest, 885 00:37:13,690 --> 00:37:14,982 You need an heir. 886 00:37:14,983 --> 00:37:17,526 That is my goal is to find an heir, 887 00:37:17,527 --> 00:37:19,737 very early on me Bill Finger Research, 888 00:37:19,738 --> 00:37:22,156 I learned that Bill had a son named Fred. 889 00:37:22,157 --> 00:37:24,700 I'm super pumped days because I think 890 00:37:24,701 --> 00:37:27,077 it will take my less than a day 891 00:37:27,078 --> 00:37:28,620 to find Fred Finger, 892 00:37:28,621 --> 00:37:29,872 and I need less than a day 893 00:37:29,873 --> 00:37:32,583 to find out that Fred is Bill's only child, 894 00:37:32,584 --> 00:37:36,628 Fred is gay, and Fred died in 1992, 895 00:37:36,629 --> 00:37:39,757 which for me is implied that he is the end 896 00:37:39,758 --> 00:37:41,133 Family Finger, 897 00:37:41,134 --> 00:37:42,634 that there is nothing left. 898 00:37:42,635 --> 00:37:45,262 And when I'm writing a book to tell a good story 899 00:37:45,263 --> 00:37:46,930 and tell an important story, 900 00:37:46,931 --> 00:37:49,767 at the same time my goal is to do what I can 901 00:37:49,768 --> 00:37:52,394 to see the name Bill added to Batman, 902 00:37:52,395 --> 00:37:56,315 but I know that to do that, you must be the heir of 903 00:37:56,316 --> 00:37:57,649 and none. 904 00:37:57,650 --> 00:38:00,068 So I then go to find anyone 905 00:38:00,069 --> 00:38:03,489 who might have several connections to this man. 906 00:38:03,490 --> 00:38:05,491 It turns out when you do detective work, 907 00:38:05,492 --> 00:38:06,825 You find yourself doing something 908 00:38:06,826 --> 00:38:08,577 that you won't do it hope you do it. 909 00:38:08,578 --> 00:38:10,871 For example, I is called every finger 910 00:38:10,872 --> 00:38:12,915 in the telephone directory, 500 names 911 00:38:12,916 --> 00:38:16,376 ask if they are related to Bill Finger. 912 00:38:16,377 --> 00:38:18,086 None. 913 00:38:18,087 --> 00:38:20,839 I stalk the apartment build Portia, 914 00:38:20,840 --> 00:38:23,133 Bill's first wife, life at the end of his life. 915 00:38:23,134 --> 00:38:24,551 I think there can still be human 916 00:38:24,552 --> 00:38:26,261 in a building that knows it. 917 00:38:26,262 --> 00:38:27,888 The next thing I know, I sit in the apartment 918 00:38:27,889 --> 00:38:30,015 with two beautiful women in their 70s 919 00:38:30,016 --> 00:38:32,434 who is in their nightgown at 6 pm 920 00:38:32,435 --> 00:38:35,229 tells me stories about Portia. 921 00:38:35,230 --> 00:38:36,939 When I don't know how do I reach people 922 00:38:36,940 --> 00:38:39,942 who knows Fred, I posted a flyer 923 00:38:39,943 --> 00:38:41,151 in community centers 924 00:38:41,152 --> 00:38:42,611 targeting gay and lesbian community 925 00:38:42,612 --> 00:38:44,863 said, "Is there anyone remember Fred Finger?" 926 00:38:44,864 --> 00:38:45,864 That's actually a brochure 927 00:38:45,865 --> 00:38:46,907 with little one pull-off things, 928 00:38:46,908 --> 00:38:49,701 You know, "I know Fred Finger" 929 00:38:49,702 --> 00:38:51,829 with my telephone number. 930 00:38:51,830 --> 00:38:52,955 Yes, this is crazy. 931 00:38:52,956 --> 00:38:55,749 Bill Finger is a charming man, 932 00:38:55,750 --> 00:38:59,419 but he is not me think, strong man. 933 00:38:59,420 --> 00:39:01,171 He is making his own way, 934 00:39:01,172 --> 00:39:03,966 and it's rather permanent 935 00:39:03,967 --> 00:39:06,969 outside looking a little. 936 00:39:06,970 --> 00:39:09,304 At some point, said Charles 937 00:39:09,305 --> 00:39:10,764 that Bill and Portia are divorced 938 00:39:10,765 --> 00:39:11,974 and Bill dating someone, 939 00:39:11,975 --> 00:39:14,351 and in the late 60's, he had a female friend 940 00:39:14,352 --> 00:39:16,645 named Edith Simmons. 941 00:39:16,646 --> 00:39:19,273 That's what Charles said, "a female friend." 942 00:39:19,274 --> 00:39:20,315 I found out that Edith 943 00:39:20,316 --> 00:39:22,651 more than just Bill's female friend, 944 00:39:22,652 --> 00:39:24,278 he is his second wife. 945 00:39:24,279 --> 00:39:27,823 Someone who is nobody comics that have been heard. 946 00:39:27,824 --> 00:39:33,036 He is very friendly, fun, 947 00:39:33,037 --> 00:39:36,540 and relaxed men. 948 00:39:36,541 --> 00:39:39,877 He has a good sense of humor, 949 00:39:39,878 --> 00:39:41,795 he... you want I tell you 950 00:39:41,796 --> 00:39:44,548 about the things he are interested in? 951 00:39:44,549 --> 00:39:47,217 He is with Charles, 952 00:39:47,218 --> 00:39:49,636 two of the biggest discoveries until then... 953 00:39:49,637 --> 00:39:51,305 two people I think 954 00:39:51,306 --> 00:39:52,848 will ensure that this 955 00:39:52,849 --> 00:39:54,474 the first real Bill Finger version 956 00:39:54,475 --> 00:39:56,185 we will know. 957 00:39:59,480 --> 00:40:02,691 He is interested in in many ways. 958 00:40:02,692 --> 00:40:05,861 He loves ballet, for For example, I like it. 959 00:40:05,862 --> 00:40:07,946 We go together. 960 00:40:07,947 --> 00:40:11,283 He is very knowledgeable about theater, 961 00:40:11,284 --> 00:40:13,201 about movies. 962 00:40:13,202 --> 00:40:15,245 He is proud to be very, 963 00:40:15,246 --> 00:40:18,081 very good comic book writers. 964 00:40:18,082 --> 00:40:20,208 There are several heroes, 965 00:40:20,209 --> 00:40:22,127 in my opinion, in this story. 966 00:40:22,128 --> 00:40:24,379 When Lyn, his second wife, 967 00:40:24,380 --> 00:40:25,881 knowing that they are making 968 00:40:25,882 --> 00:40:27,174 Batman's high-cost movie, 969 00:40:27,175 --> 00:40:30,427 which will be the Team Batman Burton 1989 film, 970 00:40:30,428 --> 00:40:34,056 he tried to get Bill credit in the film. 971 00:40:34,057 --> 00:40:35,933 This time to the big screen. 972 00:40:35,934 --> 00:40:37,851 Warner brothers spend millions 973 00:40:37,852 --> 00:40:39,269 to bring millionaire Bruce Wayne 974 00:40:39,270 --> 00:40:41,271 and alter his ego comes alive. 975 00:40:41,272 --> 00:40:42,940 Is this a gamble for the studio? 976 00:40:42,941 --> 00:40:44,274 Will Batman pay for it? 977 00:40:44,275 --> 00:40:45,776 Will there be bat hysteria? 978 00:40:45,777 --> 00:40:48,403 When Batman first the movie comes out, 979 00:40:48,404 --> 00:40:51,198 my mother became very worried 980 00:40:51,199 --> 00:40:54,368 that Bill has started there is no credit for that. 981 00:40:54,369 --> 00:40:56,370 Estimates are that final price tag 982 00:40:56,371 --> 00:40:57,829 for the Warner Brothers film 983 00:40:57,830 --> 00:41:01,124 will be at 30 to range of 50 million dollars. 984 00:41:01,125 --> 00:41:03,752 I think he should get some credit 985 00:41:03,753 --> 00:41:05,921 on the screen, 986 00:41:05,922 --> 00:41:10,759 and I try to enter relate to managers 987 00:41:10,760 --> 00:41:13,845 or anyone who tells them 988 00:41:13,846 --> 00:41:16,431 that Bill must get credit. 989 00:41:16,432 --> 00:41:17,933 We are not interested in suing, 990 00:41:17,934 --> 00:41:20,018 because we are not looking for money, 991 00:41:20,019 --> 00:41:23,188 we are only looking for credit for Bill. 992 00:41:23,189 --> 00:41:24,690 I am really dealing with the legal department 993 00:41:24,691 --> 00:41:26,066 several times. 994 00:41:26,067 --> 00:41:27,317 They disagree 995 00:41:27,318 --> 00:41:29,277 with Bill creating Batman, 996 00:41:29,278 --> 00:41:31,321 there is no conflict there. 997 00:41:31,322 --> 00:41:32,864 They don't do it want to get involved 998 00:41:32,865 --> 00:41:35,575 in something they don't have to do 999 00:41:35,576 --> 00:41:39,830 which might open some issues of responsibility for them. 1000 00:41:39,831 --> 00:41:43,250 They, I will say, refuse politely. 1001 00:41:43,251 --> 00:41:45,544 It's been long awaited Film 41 million dollars, 1002 00:41:45,545 --> 00:41:48,463 Batman, have an old model kickoff last night 1003 00:41:48,464 --> 00:41:50,132 when aired in Los Angeles. 1004 00:41:50,133 --> 00:41:52,634 Thousands of fans, many of whom are waiting all day 1005 00:41:52,635 --> 00:41:54,594 outside the theater in Westwood, 1006 00:41:54,595 --> 00:41:56,096 welcome many stars 1007 00:41:56,097 --> 00:41:57,681 which turns out to be opening. 1008 00:41:57,682 --> 00:42:00,475 So of course Batman film is a giant. 1009 00:42:00,476 --> 00:42:02,352 Batman owned in 1989. 1010 00:42:02,353 --> 00:42:04,563 Are all those people waiting now? 1011 00:42:04,564 --> 00:42:05,647 You're kidding! 1012 00:42:05,648 --> 00:42:08,525 This is Batmania this summer. 1013 00:42:08,526 --> 00:42:10,235 Everyone wants to see this movie. 1014 00:42:10,236 --> 00:42:13,113 The film is the stratosphere. 1015 00:42:13,114 --> 00:42:14,322 I have read comic books 1016 00:42:14,323 --> 00:42:15,657 since I was six years old. 1017 00:42:15,658 --> 00:42:17,325 They can't do it this movie is better. 1018 00:42:17,326 --> 00:42:19,369 Day by day, there are more signals 1019 00:42:19,370 --> 00:42:21,038 that a phenomenon is emerging. 1020 00:42:21,039 --> 00:42:23,749 There's even a 1-800-BATMAN Number 1021 00:42:23,750 --> 00:42:26,501 here to get you merchandise for you faster. 1022 00:42:26,502 --> 00:42:28,712 1989 is when Batman moved 1023 00:42:28,713 --> 00:42:30,672 only from other superheroes 1024 00:42:30,673 --> 00:42:34,426 to a fictional character everyone knows. 1025 00:42:34,427 --> 00:42:37,179 In our first Batman premier in 1989, 1026 00:42:37,180 --> 00:42:40,640 Bob appears on this black velvet bat robe. 1027 00:42:40,641 --> 00:42:42,851 Bob is fun, and Bob is a showman. 1028 00:42:42,852 --> 00:42:46,355 He likes attention, he enjoys attention. 1029 00:42:48,983 --> 00:42:51,651 My autobiography comes out, Batman & amp; I. 1030 00:42:51,652 --> 00:42:53,904 At the top the Batman One movie, 1031 00:42:53,905 --> 00:42:56,615 sold 250,000 copies. 1032 00:42:56,616 --> 00:42:58,075 That's my cover. 1033 00:42:58,076 --> 00:43:01,536 That was the first Batman I drew in 1939. 1034 00:43:01,537 --> 00:43:04,539 ♪ 1035 00:43:04,540 --> 00:43:06,958 Doing the book is interesting. 1036 00:43:06,959 --> 00:43:08,251 I helped design the book 1037 00:43:08,252 --> 00:43:10,796 and rewrite many books 1038 00:43:10,797 --> 00:43:12,923 based on many interviewing I do with him. 1039 00:43:12,924 --> 00:43:15,051 I interviewed him for hours. 1040 00:43:23,476 --> 00:43:26,561 For me, the most significant part is on page 44, 1041 00:43:26,562 --> 00:43:29,106 when Bob writes, "Now that my old friend 1042 00:43:29,107 --> 00:43:30,732 and collaborator is gone, 1043 00:43:30,733 --> 00:43:32,526 I have to admit that Bill has never been accepted 1044 00:43:32,527 --> 00:43:34,986 fame and recognition he deserves. 1045 00:43:34,987 --> 00:43:36,739 He is an unmarked hero services. " 1046 00:43:43,871 --> 00:43:45,330 "I often tell my wife, 1047 00:43:45,331 --> 00:43:48,667 if I can go back 15 years before he dies, 1048 00:43:48,668 --> 00:43:50,460 I want to say, quote, 1049 00:43:50,461 --> 00:43:51,920 & apos; I will put your name there now. 1050 00:43:51,921 --> 00:43:53,463 You deserve it. & apos; " 1051 00:43:53,464 --> 00:43:54,881 I remember when I read that, 1052 00:43:54,882 --> 00:43:56,258 and some other people told me 1053 00:43:56,259 --> 00:43:57,509 they had similar reactions. 1054 00:43:57,510 --> 00:43:58,802 They were just dumb, I mean, 1055 00:43:58,803 --> 00:44:00,137 it was like... that one of them 1056 00:44:00,138 --> 00:44:02,013 will only stop you when you read it 1057 00:44:02,014 --> 00:44:04,182 if you know something about the situation 1058 00:44:04,183 --> 00:44:07,519 because you are looking for in a book written... 1059 00:44:07,520 --> 00:44:10,605 it is allegedly written... by people it's 1060 00:44:10,606 --> 00:44:12,566 which is fully responsible, 1061 00:44:12,567 --> 00:44:14,109 or almost entirely responsible, 1062 00:44:14,110 --> 00:44:16,111 for that fact poor Bill Finger 1063 00:44:16,112 --> 00:44:18,614 never gets praise he deserves Batman. 1064 00:44:29,125 --> 00:44:32,127 He really regrets in the end 1065 00:44:32,128 --> 00:44:34,714 about Bill not getting credit. 1066 00:44:37,300 --> 00:44:40,427 It's never enough sorry to fix it. 1067 00:44:40,428 --> 00:44:43,263 I don't think he will do it ever put the name Bill 1068 00:44:43,264 --> 00:44:46,474 on the strip at that time. 1069 00:44:46,475 --> 00:44:50,437 This opens the can of legal worms 1070 00:44:50,438 --> 00:44:51,771 when he says that to me 1071 00:44:51,772 --> 00:44:53,481 which he won't do wants to enter, 1072 00:44:53,482 --> 00:44:54,608 because it won't... 1073 00:44:54,609 --> 00:44:57,987 it's not only credit but money. 1074 00:44:59,697 --> 00:45:01,656 Other things especially important things 1075 00:45:01,657 --> 00:45:05,994 about Bob's book this series of sketches, 1076 00:45:05,995 --> 00:45:09,707 which is dated _ January 17, 1934 - Yes - He has these images 1077 00:45:20,635 --> 00:45:22,969 what he said was hidden while still a child 1078 00:45:22,970 --> 00:45:25,931 and not sure whether will make it 1079 00:45:25,932 --> 00:45:27,349 being a bird or bat, 1080 00:45:27,350 --> 00:45:29,184 and he said that when he was creating 1081 00:45:29,185 --> 00:45:31,853 1082 00:45:31,854 --> 00:45:35,023 this new super hero, he remember these images 1083 00:45:35,024 --> 00:45:37,984 he made it in 1934 in this baggage, 1084 00:45:37,985 --> 00:45:39,110 and he goes to pick it up 1085 00:45:39,111 --> 00:45:40,403 and this gives him inspiration 1086 00:45:40,404 --> 00:45:43,741 to make characters become bats. 1087 00:45:55,503 --> 00:45:56,670 Wow. 1088 00:45:56,671 --> 00:45:58,713 I don't think that ever been strengthened 1089 00:45:58,714 --> 00:46:01,007 that is an actual document 1934. 1090 00:46:01,008 --> 00:46:02,509 I mean, someone must do it 1091 00:46:02,510 --> 00:46:04,552 a Shroud of Turin investigation in the 1934 sketch. 1092 00:46:04,553 --> 00:46:07,305 I mean, immediately, just date, 1093 00:46:07,306 --> 00:46:09,432 it's like you told me 1094 00:46:09,433 --> 00:46:11,017 that at dawn the comic book itself, 1095 00:46:11,018 --> 00:46:13,728 which was created in 1933, 1096 00:46:13,729 --> 00:46:16,398 before there are superheroes, of course, 1097 00:46:16,399 --> 00:46:20,944 You told me you made 1098 00:46:20,945 --> 00:46:22,570 like Batman character, Bob Kane. 1099 00:46:22,571 --> 00:46:24,906 Looking at drawing from 1934, 1100 00:46:24,907 --> 00:46:28,743 1101 00:46:28,744 --> 00:46:31,037 he wears a veil, 1102 00:46:31,038 --> 00:46:34,082 and the original Batman the picture has no cover. 1103 00:46:34,083 --> 00:46:37,419 That too... there bat symbol on it. 1104 00:46:37,420 --> 00:46:40,755 The bat symbol suggested by Finger. 1105 00:46:40,756 --> 00:46:42,924 This is not haphazard sketch. 1106 00:46:42,925 --> 00:46:44,759 This is something put together 1107 00:46:44,760 --> 00:46:47,721 by someone retrospectively trying to talk about how they appear with this character. 1108 00:46:47,722 --> 00:46:49,515 In this case, for a man to say, 1109 00:47:02,069 --> 00:47:05,030 "Bill creates a costume, 1110 00:47:05,031 --> 00:47:06,448 but here's my picture from the same costume 1111 00:47:06,449 --> 00:47:08,116 five years before." 1112 00:47:08,117 --> 00:47:10,577 It's just not how to see that 1113 00:47:10,578 --> 00:47:11,786 and don't see... see fraud occurs, 1114 00:47:11,787 --> 00:47:15,457 see who a man is desperately trying 1115 00:47:15,458 --> 00:47:17,959 to hold something he knows 1116 00:47:17,960 --> 00:47:20,211 not the right. 1117 00:47:20,212 --> 00:47:22,255 1118 00:47:22,256 --> 00:47:24,132 At some point, if you tell the story 1119 00:47:24,133 --> 00:47:26,509 enough for yourself, then that's... 1120 00:47:26,510 --> 00:47:29,513 your perception now is your reality. 1121 00:47:30,973 --> 00:47:31,973 I think that over time, 1122 00:47:31,974 --> 00:47:33,308 Bob starts feeling different 1123 00:47:33,309 --> 00:47:34,642 than he feels when he is younger, 1124 00:47:34,643 --> 00:47:36,311 but he might feel trapped by myth 1125 00:47:36,312 --> 00:47:38,313 Bob Kane, which he created, 1126 00:47:38,314 --> 00:47:40,231 and I think he might think, 1127 00:47:40,232 --> 00:47:42,609 "I will look a lot worse if I am clean now..." 1128 00:47:42,610 --> 00:47:44,027 even if possible hers conscience 1129 00:47:44,028 --> 00:47:46,029 it will be right... better things to do, 1130 00:47:46,030 --> 00:47:47,197 "... than if I... Let's see how long 1131 00:47:47,198 --> 00:47:48,323 I can drive this. 1132 00:47:48,324 --> 00:47:50,283 Maybe I can get to the graveyard 1133 00:47:50,284 --> 00:47:52,994 with nothing right challenge me in this. " 1134 00:47:52,995 --> 00:47:55,205 One day, when I'm 120 or more, 1135 00:47:55,206 --> 00:47:57,832 I will look down from the bat caves in the sky in my little creation that continues and continues and continues, 1136 00:47:57,833 --> 00:48:00,377 and I will only say, "Hey, Warner Brothers 1137 00:48:00,378 --> 00:48:02,587 and Leonardo, just send me 1138 00:48:02,588 --> 00:48:04,005 residual in the sky. 1139 00:48:04,006 --> 00:48:06,007 I will give you my address, 1140 00:48:06,008 --> 00:48:07,050 is there where are the angels be. " 1141 00:48:07,051 --> 00:48:10,845 Bob died in 1998. 1142 00:48:10,846 --> 00:48:12,514 He must live through seeing Batman 1143 00:48:12,515 --> 00:48:14,307 becomes a world phenomenon, 1144 00:48:14,308 --> 00:48:16,684 and have the right one obituary in the newspaper. 1145 00:48:16,685 --> 00:48:19,938 He is mentioned on the evening news. 1146 00:48:19,939 --> 00:48:23,233 He goes to have stars 1147 00:48:23,234 --> 00:48:24,442 on the Hollywood Walk of Fame years later. 1148 00:48:24,443 --> 00:48:27,278 Bill died in 1974 without obituary, 1149 00:48:27,279 --> 00:48:31,366 no funeral, no tombstone... 1150 00:48:31,367 --> 00:48:34,370 almost unknown. 1151 00:48:35,830 --> 00:48:38,289 1152 00:48:38,290 --> 00:48:43,545 And Bob is remembered as the creator of Batman. 1153 00:48:43,546 --> 00:48:45,130 The gravestone says, "God bestows 1154 00:48:45,131 --> 00:48:47,048 dreams on Bob Kane. 1155 00:48:47,049 --> 00:48:48,675 Blessed with divine inspiration 1156 00:48:48,676 --> 00:48:50,301 and rich imagination, 1157 00:48:50,302 --> 00:48:53,888 Bob creates inheritance known as BATMAN. 1158 00:48:53,889 --> 00:48:55,557 Bob Kane, Bruce Wayne, Batman, 1159 00:48:55,558 --> 00:48:57,559 they are one and the same. 1160 00:48:57,560 --> 00:48:59,853 Bob puts the double character identity 1161 00:48:59,854 --> 00:49:03,731 with his own attributes: kindness, kindness, 1162 00:49:03,732 --> 00:49:06,651 affection, sensitivity, generosity... " 1163 00:49:06,652 --> 00:49:08,403 I don't know him, and I'm very careful 1164 00:49:08,404 --> 00:49:09,571 to emphasize that. 1165 00:49:09,572 --> 00:49:12,407 I don't know what he is like a son 1166 00:49:12,408 --> 00:49:14,242 or a husband or father, 1167 00:49:14,243 --> 00:49:15,910 and I want to think the best. 1168 00:49:15,911 --> 00:49:17,954 And you know, he has the right to be proud of its role in Batman, but professionally, 1169 00:49:17,955 --> 00:49:20,999 1170 00:49:21,000 --> 00:49:22,333 he is not Bruce Wayne. 1171 00:49:22,334 --> 00:49:25,004 He is not what it is the word on the tombstone. 1172 00:49:27,756 --> 00:49:30,009 (birdsong) 1173 00:49:31,677 --> 00:49:34,637 Every child grows with parents 1174 00:49:34,638 --> 00:49:36,973 whose job is part of... 1175 00:49:36,974 --> 00:49:38,224 the texture of their life, 1176 00:49:38,225 --> 00:49:39,809 and unfortunately for my children, 1177 00:49:39,810 --> 00:49:42,854 it's Bill Finger, so my children know more 1178 00:49:42,855 --> 00:49:44,439 about Bill Finger at a very young age 1179 00:49:44,440 --> 00:49:46,983 from some hardcore Batman fans already know 1180 00:49:46,984 --> 00:49:49,235 at the top of their knowledge. 1181 00:49:49,236 --> 00:49:52,906 What about your father? 1182 00:49:52,907 --> 00:49:54,365 You are my father! 1183 00:49:54,366 --> 00:49:57,577 - What is my name? - Marc Tyler. 1184 00:49:57,578 --> 00:50:00,413 And what do I do all day? 1185 00:50:00,414 --> 00:50:04,042 - Work! - What is my job? 1186 00:50:04,043 --> 00:50:06,462 Bill Finger. 1187 00:50:07,671 --> 00:50:09,589 What do I do? 1188 00:50:09,590 --> 00:50:12,842 - Bill Finger. - But what does that mean? 1189 00:50:12,843 --> 00:50:15,637 Bill Finger. 1190 00:50:15,638 --> 00:50:18,139 - Who is Bill Finger? - Bill Finger. 1191 00:50:18,140 --> 00:50:19,807 Is that my friend? 1192 00:50:19,808 --> 00:50:21,809 Yes! 1193 00:50:21,810 --> 00:50:24,103 My daughter, for all intentions, grows 1194 00:50:24,104 --> 00:50:27,148 with Bill Finger as part from a large family. 1195 00:50:27,149 --> 00:50:30,860 My wife is very patient. 1196 00:50:30,861 --> 00:50:32,111 We are young and struggling, 1197 00:50:32,112 --> 00:50:34,739 and I put a lot of it in time for this project 1198 00:50:34,740 --> 00:50:36,866 because I got it consumed by this, 1199 00:50:36,867 --> 00:50:38,952 and not the point that I didn't show up 1200 00:50:38,953 --> 00:50:40,453 for family events or forget 1201 00:50:40,454 --> 00:50:41,621 to wear my shoes, 1202 00:50:41,622 --> 00:50:45,750 but I really are very focused on this. 1203 00:50:45,751 --> 00:50:47,335 Excuse me, Batman! 1204 00:50:47,336 --> 00:50:49,087 Can I ask you a few questions? 1205 00:50:49,088 --> 00:50:51,005 - Where is Batman? - Gotham City. 1206 00:50:51,006 --> 00:50:52,882 And what's the real name? 1207 00:50:52,883 --> 00:50:54,175 Bruce Wayne. 1208 00:50:54,176 --> 00:50:58,054 - And who created it? - Bob Kane. 1209 00:50:58,055 --> 00:50:59,347 Only Bob Kane? 1210 00:50:59,348 --> 00:51:01,391 When I see people wear Batman shirts 1211 00:51:01,392 --> 00:51:04,102 or Batman clothes, I do all the time, 1212 00:51:04,103 --> 00:51:05,853 yes, I smile to myself and think, 1213 00:51:05,854 --> 00:51:07,146 "Should I stop the man and ask him 1214 00:51:07,147 --> 00:51:08,481 if he knows who Bill Finger is?" 1215 00:51:08,482 --> 00:51:10,441 - Who is Dick Grayson? - Dick Grayson... 1216 00:51:10,442 --> 00:51:12,527 He is the first Robin, also Nightwing. 1217 00:51:12,528 --> 00:51:13,820 Who is Bill Finger? 1218 00:51:13,821 --> 00:51:15,113 Bill Finger? 1219 00:51:15,114 --> 00:51:16,281 He I don't know. 1220 00:51:16,282 --> 00:51:17,323 Very good story, 1221 00:51:17,324 --> 00:51:18,616 anyone who wears a Batman shirt 1222 00:51:18,617 --> 00:51:19,577 want to know that. 1223 00:51:19,578 --> 00:51:21,619 I have some Batman T-shirts left behind 1224 00:51:21,620 --> 00:51:22,704 I want to give. 1225 00:51:22,705 --> 00:51:23,997 - Does anyone want? - Sure! 1226 00:51:23,998 --> 00:51:25,582 OK. 1227 00:51:25,583 --> 00:51:26,708 They might see those clothes 1228 00:51:26,709 --> 00:51:28,209 and said, "Wait, this is not Batman. This is Finger Bill... Who is that?" 1229 00:51:28,210 --> 00:51:30,044 1230 00:51:30,045 --> 00:51:31,462 That makes me think, well, 1231 00:51:31,463 --> 00:51:33,214 the only way this will be is if by some miracle this book can be a part 1232 00:51:33,215 --> 00:51:36,259 from larger wave of support 1233 00:51:36,260 --> 00:51:38,761 it might be to cancel the idea 1234 00:51:38,762 --> 00:51:40,722 that you must be an heir to fight for credit. 1235 00:51:40,723 --> 00:51:43,349 There may be sufficient public support 1236 00:51:43,350 --> 00:51:45,226 to say there is enough evidence 1237 00:51:45,227 --> 00:51:46,978 that this person is involved 1238 00:51:46,979 --> 00:51:48,396 that we don't need an heir to make this right, 1239 00:51:48,397 --> 00:51:50,481 to make this whole again. 1240 00:51:50,482 --> 00:51:52,734 I mean, maybe that can happen, 1241 00:51:52,735 --> 00:51:53,985 I mean, the law can be reversed, right? 1242 00:51:53,986 --> 00:51:55,529 When I started this research, 1243 00:51:57,740 --> 00:51:58,948 we only know zip about Bill's family 1244 00:51:58,949 --> 00:52:01,909 with the exception of facts 1245 00:52:01,910 --> 00:52:03,077 that he has a son named Fred. 1246 00:52:03,078 --> 00:52:04,912 1247 00:52:04,913 --> 00:52:07,540 So I learned that Fred is a chef, 1248 00:52:07,541 --> 00:52:09,250 and I know that he has spent some time 1249 00:52:09,251 --> 00:52:12,128 on the west coast, and that also changes 1250 00:52:12,129 --> 00:52:13,755 that Fred has developed AIDS 1251 00:52:13,756 --> 00:52:15,798 and died in 1992. 1252 00:52:15,799 --> 00:52:19,719 He is the last survivor heir Bill Finger. 1253 00:52:19,720 --> 00:52:22,597 So my next approach is to try to find people 1254 00:52:22,598 --> 00:52:24,432 on the side of his first wife. 1255 00:52:24,433 --> 00:52:26,768 So the name is Portia, and I decided to try 1256 00:52:26,769 --> 00:52:29,437 to see through Obituaries of the New York Times. 1257 00:52:29,438 --> 00:52:31,648 ♪ 1258 00:52:31,649 --> 00:52:34,567 Before 1981 if you got hit, 1259 00:52:34,568 --> 00:52:36,486 you don't bring up the real obit, 1260 00:52:36,487 --> 00:52:39,656 You bring up the entire page where the link appears. 1261 00:52:39,657 --> 00:52:42,033 So I did this for hours, and finally I found 1262 00:52:42,034 --> 00:52:44,952 Obituary for Mrs. Portia, 1263 00:52:44,953 --> 00:52:46,579 which means Bill mother-in-law, 1264 00:52:46,580 --> 00:52:48,748 and in the obituary there are three names. 1265 00:52:48,749 --> 00:52:51,417 Fred, son of Bill, which one I already know, of course, 1266 00:52:51,418 --> 00:52:56,005 and two cousins Fred, Judy and Eric Flam. 1267 00:52:56,006 --> 00:52:58,633 So I'm looking for them, and that's possible 1268 00:52:58,634 --> 00:53:01,552 around 11 pm night on the east coast. 1269 00:53:01,553 --> 00:53:03,721 Judy is in Massachusetts, it's too late to call her, 1270 00:53:03,722 --> 00:53:06,683 just as excited as I am, but Eric is in Arizona, 1271 00:53:06,684 --> 00:53:09,102 so I called him at that time. 1272 00:53:09,103 --> 00:53:11,813 And when I call Eric, I say, "I'm a writer, 1273 00:53:11,814 --> 00:53:12,855 and I'm working on the project 1274 00:53:12,856 --> 00:53:15,316 about a writer named Bill Finger." 1275 00:53:15,317 --> 00:53:17,276 And he said, "What do you say?" 1276 00:53:17,277 --> 00:53:18,820 And I say, "Bill Finger," 1277 00:53:18,821 --> 00:53:20,697 and he put the phone to the side, 1278 00:53:20,698 --> 00:53:22,990 and he was called to his wife and said, 1279 00:53:22,991 --> 00:53:24,283 "This person's call about Bill Finger! 1280 00:53:24,284 --> 00:53:25,451 Uncle Bill, no one has ever called 1281 00:53:25,452 --> 00:53:26,661 about Uncle Bill before!" 1282 00:53:26,662 --> 00:53:27,829 And then he returns on the phone and says, 1283 00:53:27,830 --> 00:53:29,080 "Well, I don't know much. 1284 00:53:29,081 --> 00:53:30,873 My sister Judy will know more, 1285 00:53:30,874 --> 00:53:32,542 You can call her tomorrow, 1286 00:53:32,543 --> 00:53:33,918 but what I think You really have to do 1287 00:53:33,919 --> 00:53:35,670 talk to Bill grandchildren woman. " 1288 00:53:35,671 --> 00:53:39,507 And I said, "But Bill doesn't have grandchildren! 1289 00:53:39,508 --> 00:53:40,591 He said," No, but he did, " 1290 00:53:40,592 --> 00:53:43,010 and I said," Well, he only has one child, 1291 00:53:43,011 --> 00:53:44,762 Fred, who is gay, and that's it, " 1292 00:53:44,763 --> 00:53:46,514 as if I would know better than family. 1293 00:53:46,515 --> 00:53:48,182 And Eric said," That's right, 1294 00:53:48,183 --> 00:53:49,517 he has a son Fred who is gay, 1295 00:53:49,518 --> 00:53:52,812 but Fred has a daughter. " 1296 00:53:52,813 --> 00:53:54,480 When I first hear those words, 1297 00:53:54,481 --> 00:53:57,525 " You have to look for Grandson Bill, " 1298 00:53:57,526 --> 00:54:00,528 I feel like I saw a marquee film, 1299 00:54:00,529 --> 00:54:03,281 and that said, " Heir to Batman. " 1300 00:54:03,282 --> 00:54:05,158 ♪ 1301 00:54:05,159 --> 00:54:07,994 And that makes me feel like this might 1302 00:54:07,995 --> 00:54:12,206 a story that is bigger than whoever realizes. 1303 00:54:12,207 --> 00:54:14,667 The next day, I talk to Judy. 1304 00:54:14,668 --> 00:54:15,877 Judy told me 1305 00:54:15,878 --> 00:54:17,628 that its name is Athena. its existence. 1306 00:54:17,629 --> 00:54:18,671 I did not find Athena Finger 1307 00:54:18,672 --> 00:54:22,508 in the Florida directory, 1308 00:54:22,509 --> 00:54:23,718 1309 00:54:23,719 --> 00:54:27,263 1310 00:54:27,264 --> 00:54:29,015 1311 00:54:29,016 --> 00:54:30,057 1312 00:54:30,058 --> 00:54:33,102 so I'm not even sure is accurate, 1313 00:54:33,103 --> 00:54:34,896 so I finally searched online 1314 00:54:34,897 --> 00:54:36,230 to call him, 1315 00:54:36,231 --> 00:54:38,775 and I found the note her marriage. 1316 00:54:38,776 --> 00:54:41,068 He married a man named Zaido Cruz. 1317 00:54:41,069 --> 00:54:43,571 So I found mention of from Zaido Cruz 1318 00:54:43,572 --> 00:54:46,699 on the drummer's website 1319 00:54:46,700 --> 00:54:48,784 whose name is Lance, if I'm not mistaken. 1320 00:54:48,785 --> 00:54:50,119 And I emailed Lance and said, 1321 00:54:50,120 --> 00:54:51,204 "Is this Zaido Cruz 1322 00:54:51,205 --> 00:54:53,206 who is married to Athena Finger?" 1323 00:54:53,207 --> 00:54:54,749 And he said... he replied, 1324 00:54:54,750 --> 00:54:56,083 and I never talked to him, 1325 00:54:56,084 --> 00:54:58,002 but this is the sound that I hear, he is like, 1326 00:54:58,003 --> 00:55:00,463 "Yes, man, hey, man, I know Zaido! 1327 00:55:00,464 --> 00:55:01,589 Yes, he is in my band!" 1328 00:55:01,590 --> 00:55:03,090 or "I have played him, we are stuck, 1329 00:55:03,091 --> 00:55:05,176 and you must really see him, 1330 00:55:05,177 --> 00:55:06,928 and you have to find their and, you know, 1331 00:55:06,929 --> 00:55:08,429 Athena should be easy to find! " 1332 00:55:08,430 --> 00:55:09,472 And I said," How is that? " 1333 00:55:09,473 --> 00:55:10,640 And he said," Well, just look at him 1334 00:55:10,641 --> 00:55:12,141 on the Myspace page. " 1335 00:55:12,142 --> 00:55:15,102 In 2007, I didn't think about Myspace 1336 00:55:15,103 --> 00:55:16,979 or Facebook or social media at all. 1337 00:55:16,980 --> 00:55:19,148 So it was a revelation, so thank you, Lance! 1338 00:55:19,149 --> 00:55:22,860 So I saw Athena on Myspace , 1339 00:55:22,861 --> 00:55:26,280 and when I find only Athena Finger there, 1340 00:55:26,281 --> 00:55:29,116 the first thing I see is a photo of a dog, 1341 00:55:29,117 --> 00:55:33,538 and the title is, "My Dog, Bruce Wayne." 1342 00:55:33,539 --> 00:55:35,456 That is first pump moment. 1343 00:55:35,457 --> 00:55:36,707 I don't think I'm really standing 1344 00:55:36,708 --> 00:55:38,626 and doing a boxing pump, 1345 00:55:38,627 --> 00:55:39,919 that might not be my character, 1346 00:55:39,920 --> 00:55:42,046 but in my mind, I do somersaults 1347 00:55:42,047 --> 00:55:45,132 and throw the ball down 1348 00:55:45,133 --> 00:55:46,467 and do the dance in the final zone. 1349 00:55:46,468 --> 00:55:48,010 That is my moment. 1350 00:55:48,011 --> 00:55:49,178 So I had that moment before, 1351 00:55:49,179 --> 00:55:50,429 I have a moment with Charles, 1352 00:55:50,430 --> 00:55:51,973 I have a moment with Lyn, 1353 00:55:51,974 --> 00:55:55,184 but those things are filled with gaps. 1354 00:55:55,185 --> 00:55:57,770 They are not completely change the story. 1355 00:55:57,771 --> 00:56:01,816 ♪ 1356 00:56:01,817 --> 00:56:06,445 We are on our way to see Athena Finger, 1357 00:56:06,446 --> 00:56:10,658 the only heir to Bill Finger. 1358 00:56:10,659 --> 00:56:11,784 This will happen major overhaul. 1359 00:56:11,785 --> 00:56:14,996 If the credit line for Batman is changed 1360 00:56:14,997 --> 00:56:17,999 after 72 years, it will be a big problem, 1361 00:56:18,000 --> 00:56:19,542 and that will happen actually be the first. 1362 00:56:19,543 --> 00:56:21,460 I can't think of other comic characters 1363 00:56:21,461 --> 00:56:23,797 the credit line has been replaced. 1364 00:56:24,798 --> 00:56:27,091 - Hello... hey! - Hey! 1365 00:56:27,092 --> 00:56:28,467 - How are you? - How are you? 1366 00:56:28,468 --> 00:56:30,136 - Good, how are you? - Good! 1367 00:56:30,137 --> 00:56:32,680 - And this is Bruce Wayne! - That's Bruce Wayne! 1368 00:56:32,681 --> 00:56:33,932 How are you? 1369 00:56:35,350 --> 00:56:37,685 I know about Bill Finger 1370 00:56:37,686 --> 00:56:40,313 and its relationship with Batman 1371 00:56:40,314 --> 00:56:41,480 at an early age, 1372 00:56:41,481 --> 00:56:46,027 and I know that my father is excited and happy 1373 00:56:46,028 --> 00:56:48,154 about what it belongs to father has created 1374 00:56:48,155 --> 00:56:49,697 with the storyline of Batman, 1375 00:56:49,698 --> 00:56:53,492 and how he made it what we like today. 1376 00:56:53,493 --> 00:56:55,745 Marc has found me, 1377 00:56:55,746 --> 00:56:58,372 and he explained what he had done 1378 00:56:58,373 --> 00:57:00,583 and share lots information 1379 00:57:00,584 --> 00:57:02,209 which he found I don't know 1380 00:57:02,210 --> 00:57:04,795 about Bill's family and things like that. 1381 00:57:04,796 --> 00:57:07,673 He said to me, you know, 1382 00:57:07,674 --> 00:57:09,550 "I never knew my grandfather. 1383 00:57:09,551 --> 00:57:11,052 I was born two years after he died, 1384 00:57:11,053 --> 00:57:13,220 so you might be able to tell me more about him 1385 00:57:13,221 --> 00:57:15,890 than I can tell you, but I'm very interested 1386 00:57:15,891 --> 00:57:17,683 in hearing what you have to say. " 1387 00:57:17,684 --> 00:57:18,893 Bill is used to keep a lot of notes. That's interesting, 1388 00:57:18,894 --> 00:57:21,729 but it's also disappointing. and how everything is is not right 1389 00:57:21,730 --> 00:57:23,522 in the right place. 1390 00:57:23,523 --> 00:57:26,108 I told you that I found it interview with your father. 1391 00:57:26,109 --> 00:57:28,819 - Yes. - And I have it. 1392 00:57:28,820 --> 00:57:31,864 1393 00:57:31,865 --> 00:57:34,450 1394 00:57:34,451 --> 00:57:36,160 1395 00:57:36,161 --> 00:57:39,705 1396 00:57:39,706 --> 00:57:41,248 1397 00:57:41,249 --> 00:57:46,045 1398 00:57:46,046 --> 00:57:47,755 1399 00:57:47,756 --> 00:57:49,548 Oh, you have it! 1400 00:57:49,549 --> 00:57:52,176 He must write many stories 1401 00:57:52,177 --> 00:57:53,844 to make it all kinds of money. 1402 00:57:53,845 --> 00:57:56,597 He will be with 1403 00:57:56,598 --> 00:57:58,766 with some other writers... 1404 00:57:58,767 --> 00:57:59,892 And I don't know yet that there are so many traumas in the family. 1405 00:57:59,893 --> 00:58:03,104 It's not just a girl's story 1406 00:58:03,105 --> 00:58:04,647 who never knew his grandfather. 1407 00:58:04,648 --> 00:58:06,273 That's also the story of a girl 1408 00:58:06,274 --> 00:58:07,316 who has a problem with his father. 1409 00:58:07,317 --> 00:58:10,903 I haven't seen me Daddy is in, like, forever. 1410 00:58:10,904 --> 00:58:13,739 ♪ 1411 00:58:13,740 --> 00:58:17,243 My parents separated when I was three and a half years old, 1412 00:58:17,244 --> 00:58:19,203 so I don't grow with my father. 1413 00:58:19,204 --> 00:58:21,664 I just have to see it 1414 00:58:21,665 --> 00:58:22,707 maybe several times a year. 1415 00:58:22,708 --> 00:58:24,917 It's really like, if we go to New York, 1416 00:58:24,918 --> 00:58:27,253 we will go to the restaurant 1417 00:58:27,254 --> 00:58:28,295 that he is working at and dinner, 1418 00:58:28,296 --> 00:58:30,506 1419 00:58:30,507 --> 00:58:33,050 or he might come to Massachusetts 1420 00:58:33,051 --> 00:58:34,760 and spend several days. 1421 00:58:34,761 --> 00:58:36,804 It's not like me has an extended amount 1422 00:58:36,805 --> 00:58:38,806 time with him, 1423 00:58:38,807 --> 00:58:41,517 Which type of sucking, because I only have it 1424 00:58:41,518 --> 00:58:43,811 for a short time. 1425 00:58:43,812 --> 00:58:46,063 ♪ 1426 00:58:46,064 --> 00:58:48,733 I have been married six years. 1427 00:58:48,734 --> 00:58:50,860 I just understood that he was bisexual 1428 00:58:50,861 --> 00:58:52,695 since I met him, 1429 00:58:52,696 --> 00:58:54,530 and that's not the situation 1430 00:58:54,531 --> 00:58:57,408 that needs to be discussed. 1431 00:58:57,409 --> 00:59:00,161 That's something that we both understand 1432 00:59:00,162 --> 00:59:02,496 and accepted. 1433 00:59:02,497 --> 00:59:06,417 I learned that Fred HIV is positive 1434 00:59:06,418 --> 00:59:09,044 summer after I are in fourth grade, 1435 00:59:09,045 --> 00:59:11,839 be it, what, 10? 1436 00:59:11,840 --> 00:59:14,633 I spend a week with him during the summer, 1437 00:59:14,634 --> 00:59:18,512 and he and I were at the beach on Long Island, 1438 00:59:18,513 --> 00:59:21,223 and he is like, "I must talk to you." 1439 00:59:21,224 --> 00:59:24,435 So he explained, 1440 00:59:24,436 --> 00:59:25,603 "This is what happened, 1441 00:59:25,604 --> 00:59:28,315 and we don't know how long I have." 1442 00:59:30,150 --> 00:59:33,027 And then when he comes to visit us 1443 00:59:33,028 --> 00:59:34,695 just before he died, 1444 00:59:34,696 --> 00:59:37,490 he is very small, only skin and bones. 1445 00:59:37,491 --> 00:59:40,242 I mean, he doesn't have anything. 1446 00:59:40,243 --> 00:59:42,453 ♪ 1447 00:59:42,454 --> 00:59:43,621 When he comes to visit 1448 00:59:43,622 --> 00:59:46,040 near the end of his real life, 1449 00:59:46,041 --> 00:59:48,334 we ask him not to go. 1450 00:59:48,335 --> 00:59:50,169 ♪ 1451 00:59:50,170 --> 00:59:51,962 How did he respond, what did he say? 1452 00:59:51,963 --> 00:59:53,047 He said, "I have to go back. 1453 00:59:53,048 --> 00:59:55,424 I have to die in New York." 1454 00:59:55,425 --> 00:59:59,720 ♪ 1455 00:59:59,721 --> 01:00:03,390 That year is difficult. 1456 01:00:03,391 --> 01:00:06,227 Being 15 at that time, is not mature enough, 1457 01:00:06,228 --> 01:00:08,562 but must deal with real adult problems, 1458 01:00:08,563 --> 01:00:12,358 and I am very angry about many things. 1459 01:00:12,359 --> 01:00:14,026 ♪ 1460 01:00:14,027 --> 01:00:17,947 And then, when he passed went two months later, 1461 01:00:17,948 --> 01:00:20,407 I'm not included, I'm not notified, 1462 01:00:20,408 --> 01:00:22,326 I'm not... 1463 01:00:22,327 --> 01:00:25,579 I have just been excluded from everything. 1464 01:00:25,580 --> 01:00:27,957 I am really angry about that, very angry because 1465 01:00:27,958 --> 01:00:29,583 because I am his only child 1466 01:00:29,584 --> 01:00:31,752 and I should be there and I don't. 1467 01:00:31,753 --> 01:00:33,254 ♪ 1468 01:00:33,255 --> 01:00:36,048 AIDS is still very new 1469 01:00:36,049 --> 01:00:40,344 and stigmatization 1470 01:00:40,345 --> 01:00:42,763 and scary. 1471 01:00:42,764 --> 01:00:45,099 There are many conveniences 1472 01:00:45,100 --> 01:00:49,687 with people who experience the same thing 1473 01:00:49,688 --> 01:00:54,316 and he created friends' family 1474 01:00:54,317 --> 01:00:57,611 that is there when it becomes difficult. 1475 01:00:57,612 --> 01:01:01,115 So New York is the place he really must, 1476 01:01:01,116 --> 01:01:02,491 he feels. 1477 01:01:02,492 --> 01:01:07,621 ♪ 1478 01:01:07,622 --> 01:01:10,291 I still don't have a closure. 1479 01:01:10,292 --> 01:01:12,418 I was removed from everything. 1480 01:01:12,419 --> 01:01:13,586 ♪ 1481 01:01:13,587 --> 01:01:15,796 I really am. 1482 01:01:15,797 --> 01:01:17,089 Sorry. 1483 01:01:17,090 --> 01:01:20,885 ♪ 1484 01:01:20,886 --> 01:01:23,804 I wasn't even there to spread the ashes. 1485 01:01:23,805 --> 01:01:31,805 ♪ 1486 01:01:33,732 --> 01:01:35,816 I don't even know where he is. 1487 01:01:35,817 --> 01:01:42,990 ♪ 1488 01:01:42,991 --> 01:01:45,159 When Marc Nobleman calls me, 1489 01:01:45,160 --> 01:01:50,372 I said to him, "I'm not sure that this is useful 1490 01:01:50,373 --> 01:01:51,707 for the welfare of our family, 1491 01:01:51,708 --> 01:01:54,001 for this to happen be raised again." 1492 01:01:54,002 --> 01:01:58,505 We try hard to do it something about it in the past. 1493 01:01:58,506 --> 01:02:02,509 I mean, I love Fred and I want credit for Bill, 1494 01:02:02,510 --> 01:02:07,097 but we have spent years trying to get credit for it. 1495 01:02:07,098 --> 01:02:08,474 ♪ 1496 01:02:08,475 --> 01:02:12,311 Fred really wants it his father has recognition. 1497 01:02:12,312 --> 01:02:15,189 That is very important so Fred validates 1498 01:02:15,190 --> 01:02:18,692 the existence of his father and his artistic talent 1499 01:02:18,693 --> 01:02:21,654 and he gave it the best. 1500 01:02:21,655 --> 01:02:24,573 I never go to DC, Fred goes to DC alone, 1501 01:02:24,574 --> 01:02:27,952 but I understand the way that it is handled. 1502 01:02:27,953 --> 01:02:29,620 They treat you like you are a family 1503 01:02:29,621 --> 01:02:32,665 but doesn't give you anything in return for that. 1504 01:02:32,666 --> 01:02:36,085 Anything to make you feel comfortable 1505 01:02:36,086 --> 01:02:40,297 but they keep it everything for themselves. 1506 01:02:40,298 --> 01:02:41,799 After about a third lawyer, 1507 01:02:41,800 --> 01:02:45,260 Fred just said, "We just need to stop this, Bonnie, and go on." 1508 01:02:45,261 --> 01:02:51,392 So Fred never saw him his father, on the screen, 1509 01:02:51,393 --> 01:02:53,644 "One of the creators William Finger." 1510 01:02:53,645 --> 01:02:55,854 ♪ 1511 01:02:55,855 --> 01:02:58,107 Tradition in us family, unfortunately, 1512 01:02:58,108 --> 01:03:00,859 is being excluded from everything. 1513 01:03:00,860 --> 01:03:04,405 There is this understanding not recognized, 1514 01:03:04,406 --> 01:03:09,702 from what I am part of and who is my family. 1515 01:03:09,703 --> 01:03:10,828 I remember in third grade 1516 01:03:10,829 --> 01:03:14,081 we have to do this book about our life, 1517 01:03:14,082 --> 01:03:17,251 so I enter the information about my grandfather 1518 01:03:17,252 --> 01:03:19,628 and involvement with Batman and others 1519 01:03:19,629 --> 01:03:21,088 and people won't believe me 1520 01:03:21,089 --> 01:03:22,756 or they ask me. 1521 01:03:22,757 --> 01:03:25,050 So for a long time I keep quiet about it, 1522 01:03:25,051 --> 01:03:27,094 especially after me Father died. 1523 01:03:27,095 --> 01:03:28,303 ♪ 1524 01:03:28,304 --> 01:03:32,349 I always referred to like, like, dark clouds 1525 01:03:32,350 --> 01:03:33,684 who hangs over my head 1526 01:03:33,685 --> 01:03:36,145 because of that something I know 1527 01:03:36,146 --> 01:03:38,439 that needs to be fixed, 1528 01:03:38,440 --> 01:03:41,275 just don't know which way to take. 1529 01:03:41,276 --> 01:03:43,861 So it's always, like, looming. 1530 01:03:43,862 --> 01:03:46,613 ♪ 1531 01:03:46,614 --> 01:03:48,574 I don't waste time telling Athena that I will be disappointed in myself 1532 01:03:48,575 --> 01:03:50,743 if I don't tell you that this is your birthright 1533 01:03:50,744 --> 01:03:53,454 and I think for a year no one can do it 1534 01:03:53,455 --> 01:03:55,998 anything about this credit limit, 1535 01:03:55,999 --> 01:03:57,541 and I will go write this book, 1536 01:03:57,542 --> 01:03:58,917 but if we want to shoot change the credit limit, 1537 01:03:58,918 --> 01:04:02,129 it must be you. " 1538 01:04:02,130 --> 01:04:03,505 I have been told for a long time 1539 01:04:03,506 --> 01:04:04,965 that it's kind of a dead problem 1540 01:04:04,966 --> 01:04:06,633 and I shouldn't really chase it 1541 01:04:06,634 --> 01:04:08,302 and I have to leave it just like that, 1542 01:04:08,303 --> 01:04:09,678 and it will need a lot of money 1543 01:04:09,679 --> 01:04:11,805 and, like, everything these other reasons 1544 01:04:11,806 --> 01:04:13,390 1545 01:04:13,391 --> 01:04:17,144 why I can't chase add credit Bill. 1546 01:04:17,145 --> 01:04:19,772 I encourage Athena to contact DC 1547 01:04:19,773 --> 01:04:24,276 and at first he was not interested in that. 1548 01:04:24,277 --> 01:04:27,362 He is a young mother with career and life 1549 01:04:27,363 --> 01:04:28,989 and he said, "Of course I've been thinking about this, 1550 01:04:28,990 --> 01:04:30,574 but this is too scary. 1551 01:04:30,575 --> 01:04:32,701 I mean, where do you even start?" 1552 01:04:32,702 --> 01:04:35,621 Need some to convince Marc to, 1553 01:04:35,622 --> 01:04:37,539 "Athena, go, talk to them. 1554 01:04:37,540 --> 01:04:40,167 Call this person." 1555 01:04:40,168 --> 01:04:41,835 I like, "Eh, I don't know." 1556 01:04:41,836 --> 01:04:43,504 Like, I was really hesitant. 1557 01:04:43,505 --> 01:04:45,214 I don't know what to expect. 1558 01:04:45,215 --> 01:04:46,423 ♪ 1559 01:04:46,424 --> 01:04:49,468 But as soon as I talk to them, they invite me to come 1560 01:04:49,469 --> 01:04:51,303 and take a tour to the office 1561 01:04:51,304 --> 01:04:52,763 when it was still in New York City, 1562 01:04:52,764 --> 01:04:54,973 it's really cool. 1563 01:04:54,974 --> 01:04:57,351 So after that, we went to the premiere of the film 1564 01:04:57,352 --> 01:04:58,644 for "The Dark Knight" 1565 01:04:58,645 --> 01:05:02,022 and do the entire red carpet and then the afterparty party. 1566 01:05:02,023 --> 01:05:03,899 It's like, "Woo!" 1567 01:05:03,900 --> 01:05:05,109 That's amazing. 1568 01:05:05,110 --> 01:05:08,195 That is a very extraordinary scene see all these people 1569 01:05:08,196 --> 01:05:09,738 and it's like Hollywood. 1570 01:05:09,739 --> 01:05:12,324 Like, it's really cool to be there. 1571 01:05:12,325 --> 01:05:14,243 Like, "Geez, I am part of this." 1572 01:05:14,244 --> 01:05:17,204 And then they continue invite me for things. 1573 01:05:17,205 --> 01:05:19,957 You know, just really accept and, like, 1574 01:05:19,958 --> 01:05:21,166 "Please, join." 1575 01:05:21,167 --> 01:05:22,835 PR people relate to me 1576 01:05:22,836 --> 01:05:25,379 and tell me that they will pay for the room 1577 01:05:25,380 --> 01:05:27,881 and fly me and my friend here. 1578 01:05:27,882 --> 01:05:30,592 I can play movie stars briefly. 1579 01:05:30,593 --> 01:05:32,636 Everything is very fast. 1580 01:05:32,637 --> 01:05:34,888 Find the heir and then DC 1581 01:05:34,889 --> 01:05:37,891 to be very cooperative about the whole process. 1582 01:05:37,892 --> 01:05:42,020 I was very surprised with how it all happened. 1583 01:05:42,021 --> 01:05:43,730 They are very generous 1584 01:05:43,731 --> 01:05:47,734 and they send me bonus amount of money 1585 01:05:47,735 --> 01:05:48,861 for the film. 1586 01:05:48,862 --> 01:05:51,071 It says, you know, "This," you know, 1587 01:05:51,072 --> 01:05:53,031 "for its contribution." 1588 01:05:53,032 --> 01:05:56,410 You know, "We are very happy that You are part of the family now." 1589 01:05:56,411 --> 01:06:00,414 So I'm like, "Oh, this is good." 1590 01:06:00,415 --> 01:06:01,915 The term "Thank you, payment," 1591 01:06:01,916 --> 01:06:05,169 that is the case where the company wrote the author 1592 01:06:05,170 --> 01:06:07,171 or artist check 1593 01:06:07,172 --> 01:06:08,505 and say, "We give you this because you contributed something or other 1594 01:06:08,506 --> 01:06:10,465 for this character." 1595 01:06:10,466 --> 01:06:12,009 I think it's the type that's a company 1596 01:06:12,010 --> 01:06:14,011 1597 01:06:14,012 --> 01:06:16,763 want to do in the last few decades 1598 01:06:16,764 --> 01:06:19,516 like things that have to happen very big business. 1599 01:06:19,517 --> 01:06:20,767 There is so much money involved 1600 01:06:20,768 --> 01:06:22,936 and no one wants a lot of lawsuits. 1601 01:06:22,937 --> 01:06:25,022 So it's very reasonable gives a few thousand dollars, 1602 01:06:25,023 --> 01:06:26,440 $ 10,000 or $ 20,000 for someone. 1603 01:06:26,441 --> 01:06:29,610 You know, somewhere between 1604 01:06:29,611 --> 01:06:31,445 creator credit and secret money. 1605 01:06:31,446 --> 01:06:32,863 The Story of Bill Finger has a number of imperatives. 1606 01:06:32,864 --> 01:06:36,200 There are cultures this side, 1607 01:06:36,201 --> 01:06:38,911 there is a moral side to this, 1608 01:06:38,912 --> 01:06:40,954 there is that this financial side. 1609 01:06:40,955 --> 01:06:42,831 What is the value of Batman now? 1610 01:06:42,832 --> 01:06:45,125 A gob! 1611 01:06:45,126 --> 01:06:46,293 What are you talking about? 1612 01:06:46,294 --> 01:06:47,294 This is a movie, it's a toy, it's a pajamas, 1613 01:06:47,295 --> 01:06:49,630 this cartoon, this... 1614 01:06:49,631 --> 01:06:52,257 I mean, it is everyday language. 1615 01:06:52,258 --> 01:06:53,717 You say "Batman" to a grandmother... 1616 01:06:53,718 --> 01:06:55,969 1617 01:06:55,970 --> 01:06:57,262 This is the biggest brand... 1618 01:06:57,263 --> 01:07:00,098 "Batman," grandmother knows through attrition. 1619 01:07:00,099 --> 01:07:01,266 When you open a comic book , there is said, 1620 01:07:01,267 --> 01:07:02,559 "Created by Bob Kane." 1621 01:07:02,560 --> 01:07:05,395 When you see a movie, it says, "Made by Bob Kane." 1622 01:07:05,396 --> 01:07:06,939 Fixing it is something 1623 01:07:06,940 --> 01:07:09,149 all those who are scared, I think, for decades 1624 01:07:09,150 --> 01:07:11,902 because fixing it is not just a simple matter 1625 01:07:11,903 --> 01:07:15,614 put Bill Finger name to Batman. 1626 01:07:15,615 --> 01:07:17,491 This also opens the floodgates 1627 01:07:17,492 --> 01:07:19,993 to big conglomerates 1628 01:07:19,994 --> 01:07:22,621 to tap potential income. 1629 01:07:22,622 --> 01:07:26,583 DC Comics is one who speaks in a massive operation 1630 01:07:26,584 --> 01:07:27,834 that is Warner Brothers, 1631 01:07:27,835 --> 01:07:29,086 that is under Time Warner. 1632 01:07:29,087 --> 01:07:31,588 So, I mean, it's very big media companies, of course, 1633 01:07:31,589 --> 01:07:34,258 and Batman are one of them the biggest money maker 1634 01:07:34,259 --> 01:07:36,677 in fiction, point. 1635 01:07:36,678 --> 01:07:40,806 So DC is under Warner Brothers umbrella 1636 01:07:40,807 --> 01:07:43,141 but as soon as we arrive to "The Dark Knight Rises," 1637 01:07:43,142 --> 01:07:45,143 Warner brothers really watch over 1638 01:07:45,144 --> 01:07:47,688 all sides of the company. 1639 01:07:47,689 --> 01:07:50,148 Which brings me into 2012 1640 01:07:50,149 --> 01:07:52,276 when "The Dark Knight Increases" out 1641 01:07:52,277 --> 01:07:54,236 and I get an email say, you know, 1642 01:07:54,237 --> 01:07:57,948 "We want to have it You signed this document 1643 01:07:57,949 --> 01:08:00,200 so we can give you a check, 1644 01:08:00,201 --> 01:08:02,202 be signed and please return it." 1645 01:08:02,203 --> 01:08:03,787 But the point is do they want me 1646 01:08:03,788 --> 01:08:06,748 to terminate my right for any type of claim. 1647 01:08:06,749 --> 01:08:08,542 They want me to close the door 1648 01:08:08,543 --> 01:08:11,586 on Bill getting whatever type of credit. 1649 01:08:11,587 --> 01:08:14,215 They try to make me calm. 1650 01:08:16,926 --> 01:08:17,926 Yes right? 1651 01:08:17,927 --> 01:08:19,219 - So this is for you? - Yes, please. 1652 01:08:19,220 --> 01:08:20,387 Alex or Alex... 1653 01:08:20,388 --> 01:08:21,847 - Alex. - Good. 1654 01:08:21,848 --> 01:08:23,557 I have this blind faith so far 1655 01:08:23,558 --> 01:08:26,226 that I will see the book until publication. 1656 01:08:26,227 --> 01:08:28,770 Although, believe me, there are many roadblocks 1657 01:08:28,771 --> 01:08:30,063 and obstacles. 1658 01:08:30,064 --> 01:08:31,898 So, open the book is a great achievement; 1659 01:08:31,899 --> 01:08:35,652 just to see any book is something I'm proud of. 1660 01:08:35,653 --> 01:08:37,321 This book came out in 2012 1661 01:08:37,322 --> 01:08:40,574 and with that come a opportunity to talk about Bill 1662 01:08:40,575 --> 01:08:43,160 in that arena is even bigger than a book. 1663 01:08:43,161 --> 01:08:44,870 Secret identities are for superheroes, 1664 01:08:44,871 --> 01:08:46,246 not the people behind them. 1665 01:08:46,247 --> 01:08:48,790 I have a chance to do TED Talk. 1666 01:08:48,791 --> 01:08:51,209 Life Bill Finger ends tragically, 1667 01:08:51,210 --> 01:08:53,795 but the story isn't finished yet. 1668 01:08:53,796 --> 01:08:55,505 I was interviewed at NPR. 1669 01:08:55,506 --> 01:08:57,299 Now if you have seen it "The awakening of the dark knight," 1670 01:08:57,300 --> 01:09:00,594 the name isn't there is Bill Finger. 1671 01:09:00,595 --> 01:09:03,930 I have the opportunity to go on Kevin Smith's podcast. 1672 01:09:03,931 --> 01:09:06,516 Does he have an heir, is there a family? 1673 01:09:06,517 --> 01:09:08,268 Yes, okay, that's is the biggest, uh, 1674 01:09:08,269 --> 01:09:09,770 my research findings. 1675 01:09:09,771 --> 01:09:11,813 By law I can't do it everything to change this, 1676 01:09:11,814 --> 01:09:12,774 but he can. 1677 01:09:12,775 --> 01:09:14,733 He is Batgirl for heaven's sake. 1678 01:09:14,734 --> 01:09:18,195 When you have someone who speaks loudly, 1679 01:09:18,196 --> 01:09:21,782 recommend it out loud in the name of the cause, 1680 01:09:21,783 --> 01:09:23,909 something will be done. 1681 01:09:23,910 --> 01:09:26,787 That evokes these bubbles movements, you know, 1682 01:09:26,788 --> 01:09:28,330 where suddenly You start hearing 1683 01:09:28,331 --> 01:09:29,873 more and more about Bill Finger. 1684 01:09:29,874 --> 01:09:31,458 He doesn't have Batman himself, 1685 01:09:31,459 --> 01:09:33,293 but I think you Batman Bill Finger, 1686 01:09:33,294 --> 01:09:34,461 for heaven's sake. 1687 01:09:34,462 --> 01:09:36,213 You are that will find him justice. 1688 01:09:36,214 --> 01:09:37,090 ♪ 1689 01:09:37,091 --> 01:09:38,673 I keep talking about raising soldiers 1690 01:09:38,674 --> 01:09:39,966 and support waves, 1691 01:09:39,967 --> 01:09:41,176 but I never really stop thinking, 1692 01:09:41,177 --> 01:09:42,761 "Well, that's also people." 1693 01:09:42,762 --> 01:09:45,597 So it starts really being my driving force 1694 01:09:45,598 --> 01:09:47,974 I can't let it all these people. 1695 01:09:47,975 --> 01:09:50,477 So I do some basic on one level, 1696 01:09:50,478 --> 01:09:51,812 but we need something else happens 1697 01:09:51,813 --> 01:09:53,188 at another level. 1698 01:09:53,189 --> 01:09:55,982 ♪ 1699 01:09:55,983 --> 01:09:57,067 It's been one year 1700 01:09:57,068 --> 01:10:00,320 since Marc Nobleman the book is out. 1701 01:10:00,321 --> 01:10:02,989 So more people start contacting me, 1702 01:10:02,990 --> 01:10:05,827 "Are you really Bill's grandson?" 1703 01:10:17,505 --> 01:10:20,048 (laughter) 1704 01:10:20,049 --> 01:10:22,551 And here it is the first convention ever. 1705 01:10:22,552 --> 01:10:24,010 (applause) 1706 01:10:24,011 --> 01:10:25,721 I bring Athena into the convention. 1707 01:10:25,722 --> 01:10:27,806 Are we talking about the Wizard World convention, 1708 01:10:27,807 --> 01:10:31,017 or San Diego, or New York Comic Con, 1709 01:10:31,018 --> 01:10:32,853 I brought it into the number that year, 1710 01:10:32,854 --> 01:10:35,522 to meet fans and get it out 1711 01:10:35,523 --> 01:10:38,859 from that curtain he lives behind, 1712 01:10:38,860 --> 01:10:40,694 to meet other people. 1713 01:10:40,695 --> 01:10:44,030 I have never been to a previous formal conventions, 1714 01:10:44,031 --> 01:10:45,073 all the items. 1715 01:10:45,074 --> 01:10:47,701 So I made my first panel, I was very nervous. 1716 01:10:47,702 --> 01:10:50,328 I like, "I don't even know what I am talking about." 1717 01:10:50,329 --> 01:10:52,706 Fans will ask him questions and he will say, 1718 01:10:52,707 --> 01:10:54,708 "I'm learning these things from you." 1719 01:10:54,709 --> 01:10:57,961 He is learning a lot of things about his grandfather 1720 01:10:57,962 --> 01:11:00,714 and inheritance and exactly what Bill 1721 01:11:00,715 --> 01:11:03,800 did of all of us because he is an adult 1722 01:11:03,801 --> 01:11:06,052 with that being this becomes uncomfortable. 1723 01:11:06,053 --> 01:11:08,680 Isn't this extraordinary things to tell everyone, 1724 01:11:08,681 --> 01:11:10,265 "Hey, my grandfather one of the co-creators 1725 01:11:10,266 --> 01:11:11,933 Batman," when did you grow up? 1726 01:11:11,934 --> 01:11:13,894 You will think will be a great thing, 1727 01:11:13,895 --> 01:11:16,480 but, um, growing up, no, not that. 1728 01:11:16,481 --> 01:11:19,232 I avoid talking about it. 1729 01:11:19,233 --> 01:11:20,233 When I get older... 1730 01:11:20,234 --> 01:11:22,986 He does not want to speak to the crowd itself, 1731 01:11:22,987 --> 01:11:24,946 he wants to get it information out, 1732 01:11:24,947 --> 01:11:26,364 so he still does it. 1733 01:11:26,365 --> 01:11:28,575 And I think it's a bit heroic. 1734 01:11:28,576 --> 01:11:30,368 Part of Athens the process of grieving 1735 01:11:30,369 --> 01:11:32,120 will be a Comic Con and talk 1736 01:11:32,121 --> 01:11:36,416 about his grandfather and his father. 1737 01:11:36,417 --> 01:11:39,085 It's really beautiful to see. 1738 01:11:39,086 --> 01:11:41,755 And he will be there with him 1739 01:11:41,756 --> 01:11:45,008 because that is something Fred wants his father. 1740 01:11:45,009 --> 01:11:46,051 - Good. - There we go. 1741 01:11:46,052 --> 01:11:49,679 There are so many support from people. 1742 01:11:49,680 --> 01:11:52,682 They really, really want to see the name Bill 1743 01:11:52,683 --> 01:11:55,101 inherent in Batman, as it should. 1744 01:11:55,102 --> 01:11:57,938 Comic book fans, they are fights are on the page. 1745 01:11:57,939 --> 01:12:00,607 They don't take it real world or anything. 1746 01:12:00,608 --> 01:12:03,360 But those fights they are involved in, 1747 01:12:03,361 --> 01:12:04,778 it's not boxing, 1748 01:12:04,779 --> 01:12:06,071 battle for the right thing. 1749 01:12:06,072 --> 01:12:07,072 And how can they not? 1750 01:12:07,073 --> 01:12:08,281 Because their characters they read about 1751 01:12:08,282 --> 01:12:10,116 all the time doing the same thing. 1752 01:12:10,117 --> 01:12:12,077 That is your role model on the page. 1753 01:12:12,078 --> 01:12:14,287 So while Bill doesn't train people 1754 01:12:14,288 --> 01:12:16,456 to fight for it after he dies, 1755 01:12:16,457 --> 01:12:17,791 You have a lot of people who read 1756 01:12:17,792 --> 01:12:19,835 and influenced by Bill Finger's work, 1757 01:12:19,836 --> 01:12:23,755 like this is true, is just what. 1758 01:12:23,756 --> 01:12:27,008 So that's where I am got a lot of pressure from, 1759 01:12:27,009 --> 01:12:28,009 from fans. 1760 01:12:28,010 --> 01:12:29,177 "Why isn't this happening? 1761 01:12:29,178 --> 01:12:30,637 Why isn't the name attached? 1762 01:12:30,638 --> 01:12:31,888 What happened? 1763 01:12:31,889 --> 01:12:33,306 Why... what, what, what? 1764 01:12:33,307 --> 01:12:34,432 Tell me, tell me, tell me. 1765 01:12:34,433 --> 01:12:35,475 = = How do I do it? 1766 01:12:35,476 --> 01:12:36,643 Do it, do it, do it. " 1767 01:12:36,644 --> 01:12:38,854 And I know that 1768 01:12:38,855 --> 01:12:41,648 something is happening to get out of it. 1769 01:12:41,649 --> 01:12:46,152 In 2014, WonderCon was held in Anaheim, California, 1770 01:12:46,153 --> 01:12:48,989 and there is this Batman panel. 1771 01:12:48,990 --> 01:12:52,617 And audience members wake up to the microphone 1772 01:12:52,618 --> 01:12:54,369 and ask this question about, 1773 01:12:54,370 --> 01:12:56,162 "Will Bill Finger get credit?" 1774 01:12:56,163 --> 01:12:58,623 And there are just staying there. 1775 01:12:58,624 --> 01:13:01,001 One member of the panel says, "Cricket." 1776 01:13:01,002 --> 01:13:05,088 And someone who works for DC, 1777 01:13:05,089 --> 01:13:06,506 Larry Ganem, 1778 01:13:06,507 --> 01:13:08,758 wake up and he says that, 1779 01:13:08,759 --> 01:13:12,345 "We're all fine Finger and his family." 1780 01:13:12,346 --> 01:13:17,017 And that's when, "Okay, we have to reply to this." 1781 01:13:17,018 --> 01:13:19,686 Athena and I put the joint statement, 1782 01:13:19,687 --> 01:13:24,816 "No, everything is not good with the Finger family." 1783 01:13:24,817 --> 01:13:26,860 Time is everything. 1784 01:13:26,861 --> 01:13:29,696 75th birthday Batman is coming, 1785 01:13:29,697 --> 01:13:31,698 it's a hundred birthdays 1786 01:13:31,699 --> 01:13:33,533 the birth of my grandfather, 1787 01:13:33,534 --> 01:13:36,703 it's the 25th day of the day being film & apos; 89. 1788 01:13:36,704 --> 01:13:40,665 Like all these items come together in 2014. 1789 01:13:40,666 --> 01:13:43,501 I called Athena and we had a big shout 1790 01:13:43,502 --> 01:13:45,670 more than Fred goes. 1791 01:13:45,671 --> 01:13:48,381 And then we discuss it. 1792 01:13:48,382 --> 01:13:50,508 Maybe it's time for Bill Finger 1793 01:13:50,509 --> 01:13:53,470 get recognition that deserves. 1794 01:13:53,471 --> 01:13:58,725 And that's when the became a fight. 1795 01:13:58,726 --> 01:14:01,436 I feel that the time is right. 1796 01:14:01,437 --> 01:14:04,439 I know that now or not at all. 1797 01:14:04,440 --> 01:14:07,734 And I thought I called my brother first. 1798 01:14:07,735 --> 01:14:10,403 We have a different father, he is older than me. 1799 01:14:10,404 --> 01:14:13,365 He feels like that really loads in his life 1800 01:14:13,366 --> 01:14:17,494 inherit this controversy, basically. 1801 01:14:17,495 --> 01:14:19,621 Knowing that I am only one can do it 1802 01:14:19,622 --> 01:14:20,747 is a very large burden. 1803 01:14:20,748 --> 01:14:24,668 So that's really... I want to solve it 1804 01:14:24,669 --> 01:14:27,087 knowing that I only have one chance. 1805 01:14:27,088 --> 01:14:30,674 Being a lawyer, I... I can 1806 01:14:30,675 --> 01:14:34,177 to assess what resources we have and don't have. 1807 01:14:34,178 --> 01:14:37,639 So he contacted me because he was looking for 1808 01:14:37,640 --> 01:14:40,475 copyright lawyers to help him 1809 01:14:40,476 --> 01:14:43,228 with the situation. 1810 01:14:43,229 --> 01:14:45,313 Copyright law says 1811 01:14:45,314 --> 01:14:49,609 when two people make part of something 1812 01:14:49,610 --> 01:14:51,987 which is meant to be combined 1813 01:14:51,988 --> 01:14:54,489 becomes an integral job, 1814 01:14:54,490 --> 01:14:56,157 then it is working together 1815 01:14:56,158 --> 01:14:59,661 and each of them is the co-owner. 1816 01:14:59,662 --> 01:15:04,791 So enter this, one of them the most frequently cited facts 1817 01:15:04,792 --> 01:15:07,460 Batman's knowledge is that Bob Kane 1818 01:15:07,461 --> 01:15:09,671 negotiate a contract where he will be 1819 01:15:09,672 --> 01:15:12,132 the only creator of in Batman, 1820 01:15:12,133 --> 01:15:14,884 he will be the only name registered as creator. 1821 01:15:14,885 --> 01:15:17,345 The only thing I always do is from people 1822 01:15:17,346 --> 01:15:19,222 the one I have talked to on DC is, 1823 01:15:19,223 --> 01:15:21,057 "We know what your grandfather, 1824 01:15:21,058 --> 01:15:22,934 we hope we can enter his name there, 1825 01:15:22,935 --> 01:15:25,937 but we can't because of that the contract that we have." 1826 01:15:25,938 --> 01:15:28,648 Bob Kane's famous contract 1827 01:15:28,649 --> 01:15:30,692 never before disclosed to the public, 1828 01:15:30,693 --> 01:15:32,360 as expected. 1829 01:15:32,361 --> 01:15:34,487 I mean, this is big character, big company, 1830 01:15:34,488 --> 01:15:36,281 they have no obligation to share 1831 01:15:36,282 --> 01:15:39,367 all contents from their vault. 1832 01:15:39,368 --> 01:15:42,412 If there are companies that agree 1833 01:15:42,413 --> 01:15:44,914 which is clearly spelled their rights 1834 01:15:44,915 --> 01:15:48,084 and it's closed claims copyright, 1835 01:15:48,085 --> 01:15:51,755 it seems to me that they will produce it. 1836 01:15:51,756 --> 01:15:53,590 I don't know why you don't want to. 1837 01:15:53,591 --> 01:15:55,467 Maybe a rumor, that might be a myth 1838 01:15:55,468 --> 01:15:58,970 that DC Comic is in progress 1839 01:15:58,971 --> 01:16:01,097 because it helps them. 1840 01:16:01,098 --> 01:16:02,348 Or maybe real 1841 01:16:02,349 --> 01:16:05,977 and the original source is Bob. 1842 01:16:05,978 --> 01:16:07,854 That's another interesting thing 1843 01:16:07,855 --> 01:16:10,356 about the copyright law that is being played here. 1844 01:16:10,357 --> 01:16:11,649 Someone just claims 1845 01:16:11,650 --> 01:16:13,860 that they are the only writers when they are not, 1846 01:16:13,861 --> 01:16:15,862 it's not really... That doesn't really happen. 1847 01:16:15,863 --> 01:16:20,033 So you see what does Bill Finger contribute? 1848 01:16:20,034 --> 01:16:22,702 Does that make him a joint author of 1849 01:16:22,703 --> 01:16:24,829 or co-owner of the job? 1850 01:16:24,830 --> 01:16:27,707 Marc Tyler Nobleman sort of took this case, 1851 01:16:27,708 --> 01:16:30,126 investigate research, 1852 01:16:30,127 --> 01:16:31,586 and of course, Bob Kane, 1853 01:16:31,587 --> 01:16:32,754 You know, finally is rather helpful by talking about Bill his own contribution. 1854 01:16:32,755 --> 01:16:35,591 Um, that's very important. 1855 01:16:43,724 --> 01:16:47,060 If poor Athena, like, must start 1856 01:16:47,061 --> 01:16:48,561 with the threshold problem, 1857 01:16:48,562 --> 01:16:50,230 that's all really, very difficult. 1858 01:16:50,231 --> 01:16:52,649 I mean, this is very big entertainment company 1859 01:16:52,650 --> 01:16:56,236 with all departments from, you know, lawyers. 1860 01:16:56,237 --> 01:16:59,572 And then there is, You know, Athena Finger. 1861 01:16:59,573 --> 01:17:01,950 ♪ 1862 01:17:01,951 --> 01:17:05,245 Unfortunately, for the people who created the story 1863 01:17:05,246 --> 01:17:08,206 about superheroes who are selfless and save people's lives, 1864 01:17:08,207 --> 01:17:10,458 there isn't much 1865 01:17:10,459 --> 01:17:12,168 generosity that happens here. 1866 01:17:12,169 --> 01:17:14,671 You have a creator who fights a company on character. 1867 01:17:14,672 --> 01:17:16,506 And, you know, this is classic The story of David and Goliath. 1868 01:17:16,507 --> 01:17:20,343 1869 01:17:20,344 --> 01:17:24,597 1870 01:17:24,598 --> 01:17:28,434 And in this case, usually the favored does not win. 1871 01:17:28,435 --> 01:17:31,813 As a teenager in Cleveland in 1933, 1872 01:17:31,814 --> 01:17:33,523 these two boys sign a sheet of paper 1873 01:17:33,524 --> 01:17:35,525 that, basically, sells their rights, 1874 01:17:35,526 --> 01:17:37,110 and they sell it for $ 130 Well, they are only children 1875 01:17:37,111 --> 01:17:38,570 and they are very worried to be published, 1876 01:17:38,571 --> 01:17:40,613 really want to get recognition, 1877 01:17:40,614 --> 01:17:42,115 they sign their copyright. 1878 01:17:42,116 --> 01:17:44,784 Superman becomes like Superman 1879 01:17:44,785 --> 01:17:46,661 because DC builds Superman 1880 01:17:46,662 --> 01:17:50,623 to that industry. 1881 01:17:50,624 --> 01:17:52,750 But still, Siegel and Shuster 1882 01:17:52,751 --> 01:17:54,794 deserves more more than they get. 1883 01:17:54,795 --> 01:17:57,255 You know, they make it some effort 1884 01:17:57,256 --> 01:18:00,633 to get greater credit. 1885 01:18:00,634 --> 01:18:03,845 In their 1947 suit, 1886 01:18:03,846 --> 01:18:05,680 1887 01:18:05,681 --> 01:18:09,017 Siegel and Shuster don't get Superman ownership. 1888 01:18:09,018 --> 01:18:11,769 They get $ 94,000 more, 1889 01:18:11,770 --> 01:18:13,229 but National Periodical 1890 01:18:13,230 --> 01:18:15,732 then owned by Superman and Superboy 1891 01:18:15,733 --> 01:18:17,942 and shoot Siegel and Shuster. 1892 01:18:17,943 --> 01:18:19,027 Creator of Superman 1893 01:18:19,028 --> 01:18:23,823 first sued for credit in 1947. 1894 01:18:23,824 --> 01:18:27,368 They are still working for the company at that time. 1895 01:18:27,369 --> 01:18:30,496 So they lose the lawsuits, they lose their jobs, 1896 01:18:30,497 --> 01:18:33,166 and company who become DC Comics 1897 01:18:33,167 --> 01:18:34,918 take their name from Superman. 1898 01:18:34,919 --> 01:18:37,629 In 1963, Siegel and Shuster 1899 01:18:37,630 --> 01:18:39,172 start another setting, 1900 01:18:39,173 --> 01:18:40,924 this one to win back the copyright 1901 01:18:40,925 --> 01:18:44,177 when it appeared for updates in 1966. 1902 01:18:44,178 --> 01:18:45,345 Court findings, 1903 01:18:45,346 --> 01:18:48,681 "Superman belongs to National Periodical." 1904 01:18:48,682 --> 01:18:52,018 Short story Superman has 1905 01:18:52,019 --> 01:18:54,562 subjects of litigation almost from the beginning, 1906 01:18:54,563 --> 01:18:58,024 and that has been going on for decades at this time. 1907 01:18:58,025 --> 01:19:00,610 And most of the majors players are lost, 1908 01:19:00,611 --> 01:19:04,197 so it's passed on to the second generation. 1909 01:19:04,198 --> 01:19:06,783 When you're dealing with something very big, 1910 01:19:06,784 --> 01:19:08,326 the bet is large on both sides 1911 01:19:08,327 --> 01:19:10,495 a challenge, from a contest. 1912 01:19:10,496 --> 01:19:13,039 And you know, Superman 1913 01:19:13,040 --> 01:19:14,916 situation will not be implanted a lot of confidence 1914 01:19:14,917 --> 01:19:17,168 You can win. 1915 01:19:17,169 --> 01:19:20,922 To encourage this type further claims, 1916 01:19:20,923 --> 01:19:24,550 You must have the means 1917 01:19:24,551 --> 01:19:27,387 and, frankly, money to do it. 1918 01:19:27,388 --> 01:19:30,390 And no one, really, 1919 01:19:30,391 --> 01:19:33,226 even if you have multi-millions in the bank, 1920 01:19:33,227 --> 01:19:35,895 want to go through that risk. 1921 01:19:35,896 --> 01:19:38,481 We will do it maybe invest 1922 01:19:38,482 --> 01:19:40,566 five to ten years of our lives 1923 01:19:40,567 --> 01:19:42,026 Enter litigation 1924 01:19:42,027 --> 01:19:45,780 against multi-national companies. 1925 01:19:45,781 --> 01:19:49,742 To be honest, that is my strategy not to go down the road, 1926 01:19:49,743 --> 01:19:53,079 but, of course, making it seems we will do it. 1927 01:19:53,080 --> 01:19:54,039 ♪ 1928 01:19:54,040 --> 01:19:56,249 We will return so far. 1929 01:19:56,250 --> 01:19:59,711 If we will assume that all of these things 1930 01:19:59,712 --> 01:20:02,505 what people say the press is true 1931 01:20:02,506 --> 01:20:05,258 about Bill Finger and about its contribution 1932 01:20:05,259 --> 01:20:06,884 and the path goes down, 1933 01:20:06,885 --> 01:20:12,140 then they each have half Batman as a whole. 1934 01:20:12,141 --> 01:20:15,101 There may be arguments from the company side 1935 01:20:15,102 --> 01:20:19,397 that it is not working together because he is an employee. 1936 01:20:19,398 --> 01:20:22,025 I have never heard of any documents 1937 01:20:22,026 --> 01:20:23,901 who says that he is. 1938 01:20:23,902 --> 01:20:26,070 I have never heard of it a document that says 1939 01:20:26,071 --> 01:20:28,656 he works under a job to rent. 1940 01:20:28,657 --> 01:20:30,450 So, this is step one and two steps 1941 01:20:30,451 --> 01:20:31,492 and step three and four steps 1942 01:20:31,493 --> 01:20:34,329 and all this leads to, hypothetically, 1943 01:20:34,330 --> 01:20:36,247 yes, you take it back. 1944 01:20:36,248 --> 01:20:38,291 That's leverage copyright law, 1945 01:20:38,292 --> 01:20:40,585 to really allow people to take it back 1946 01:20:40,586 --> 01:20:42,754 or put the big company 1947 01:20:42,755 --> 01:20:45,298 in position must renegotiate 1948 01:20:45,299 --> 01:20:48,301 their royalties or whatever. 1949 01:20:48,302 --> 01:20:50,720 I believe being there is a risk on both sides 1950 01:20:50,721 --> 01:20:55,516 and we have highlighted enough of that risk 1951 01:20:55,517 --> 01:20:57,810 so they talk with us, 1952 01:20:57,811 --> 01:20:59,562 and that's the goal. 1953 01:20:59,563 --> 01:21:01,814 ♪ 1954 01:21:01,815 --> 01:21:03,149 I don't imagine that I will do it 1955 01:21:03,150 --> 01:21:05,610 is actually in the last meeting, 1956 01:21:05,611 --> 01:21:07,612 but it happened in July, 1957 01:21:07,613 --> 01:21:10,073 it's negotiating closed doors, 1958 01:21:10,074 --> 01:21:14,577 and that's a big problem so many different levels. 1959 01:21:14,578 --> 01:21:15,578 ♪ 1960 01:21:15,579 --> 01:21:17,580 Someone has a goal and other people have a purpose 1961 01:21:17,581 --> 01:21:19,248 and how you negotiate 1962 01:21:19,249 --> 01:21:20,917 and maybe not makes everyone happy, 1963 01:21:20,918 --> 01:21:24,128 but for everyone is not terrible. 1964 01:21:24,129 --> 01:21:25,213 I don't know if they know, 1965 01:21:25,214 --> 01:21:28,007 but I'm very nervous. 1966 01:21:28,008 --> 01:21:29,675 We really want to get credit, 1967 01:21:29,676 --> 01:21:33,137 but we don't know which this method will go, 1968 01:21:33,138 --> 01:21:34,514 we really don't. 1969 01:21:34,515 --> 01:21:38,142 ♪ 1970 01:21:38,143 --> 01:21:39,852 There is a point where I don't lead the charge 1971 01:21:39,853 --> 01:21:41,646 again because I'm not a family, 1972 01:21:41,647 --> 01:21:44,857 and only so far I can go without family. 1973 01:21:44,858 --> 01:21:47,068 Hey, Raf-bear. 1974 01:21:47,069 --> 01:21:48,194 - Nice to see you, kid. - Hello. 1975 01:21:48,195 --> 01:21:49,654 - How is my favorite fur ball? - Good. 1976 01:21:49,655 --> 01:21:50,655 Yes? 1977 01:21:50,656 --> 01:21:53,157 So in the summer of 2015, 1978 01:21:53,158 --> 01:21:54,367 everything is being built. 1979 01:21:54,368 --> 01:21:55,368 I can feel it. 1980 01:21:55,369 --> 01:21:57,328 And in September, 1981 01:21:57,329 --> 01:22:00,206 it feels like we get to that critical point. 1982 01:22:00,207 --> 01:22:01,916 ♪ 1983 01:22:01,917 --> 01:22:05,336 It was September 18, it was Friday. 1984 01:22:05,337 --> 01:22:06,629 I travel a lot, 1985 01:22:06,630 --> 01:22:07,713 but I happen to be home that day, 1986 01:22:07,714 --> 01:22:09,590 In fact, I am alone at home. 1987 01:22:09,591 --> 01:22:13,177 And I happen to have this set of things 1988 01:22:13,178 --> 01:22:15,888 I have to do for that day, and, very unusual, 1989 01:22:15,889 --> 01:22:19,225 I have finished it quite far before noon. 1990 01:22:19,226 --> 01:22:21,310 And tweets and emails 1991 01:22:21,311 --> 01:22:23,104 and blog posts and Facebook posts 1992 01:22:23,105 --> 01:22:24,439 start pouring. 1993 01:22:24,440 --> 01:22:25,940 And I have a partner hours for myself 1994 01:22:25,941 --> 01:22:29,527 where I used to be catatonic almost. 1995 01:22:29,528 --> 01:22:31,904 The first person in my family to go home 1996 01:22:31,905 --> 01:22:33,364 is my daughter. 1997 01:22:33,365 --> 01:22:34,907 ♪ 1998 01:22:34,908 --> 01:22:36,409 Do you see it? 1999 01:22:36,410 --> 01:22:38,161 Yes! 2000 01:22:38,162 --> 01:22:39,495 What does it say? 2001 01:22:39,496 --> 01:22:41,998 "DC gives Bill Official finger credit 2002 01:22:41,999 --> 01:22:46,252 on & apos; Batman &"; versus, I think, "& apos; Superman & apos; and & apos; Gotham & apos;"? 2003 01:22:46,253 --> 01:22:47,420 Mm-hm. 2004 01:22:47,421 --> 01:22:49,255 They give him credit? 2005 01:22:49,256 --> 01:22:51,382 They give him credit now. 2006 01:22:51,383 --> 01:22:52,925 What? 2007 01:22:52,926 --> 01:22:53,968 What? 2008 01:22:53,969 --> 01:22:55,261 (laugh) 2009 01:22:55,262 --> 01:22:57,680 How do you do it? 2010 01:22:57,681 --> 01:22:59,599 How do you do it? 2011 01:22:59,600 --> 01:23:01,976 "You succeeded, Marc, you have justice for Bill Finger 2012 01:23:01,977 --> 01:23:03,561 and sacrificed for life is wrong! 2013 01:23:03,562 --> 01:23:05,062 You are Batman for Bill!" 2014 01:23:05,063 --> 01:23:06,481 That's Kevin Smith. 2015 01:23:06,482 --> 01:23:08,149 There is a huge difference between me and Batman, 2016 01:23:08,150 --> 01:23:10,776 but I will accept it as a good compliment. 2017 01:23:10,777 --> 01:23:12,904 "Bill Finger gets justice." 2018 01:23:12,905 --> 01:23:14,447 That's from Kevin Conroy, 2019 01:23:14,448 --> 01:23:15,990 who is the voice of Batman 2020 01:23:15,991 --> 01:23:18,784 from the beginning Batman: The Animated Series. 2021 01:23:18,785 --> 01:23:21,287 "On my honeymoon in Mexico from Ireland. 2022 01:23:21,288 --> 01:23:22,413 Just saw the news. 2023 01:23:22,414 --> 01:23:25,041 Happy for you, Bill, and Finger family." 2024 01:23:25,042 --> 01:23:26,626 But I'm pretty sure one people aren't happy 2025 01:23:26,627 --> 01:23:29,170 is his new bride, 2026 01:23:29,171 --> 01:23:31,380 the new husband is tweeting about Batman 2027 01:23:31,381 --> 01:23:32,798 on honeymoon. 2028 01:23:32,799 --> 01:23:35,259 But thank you very much, Burke. 2029 01:23:35,260 --> 01:23:37,720 "DC Entertainment and family Bill Finger 2030 01:23:37,721 --> 01:23:38,639 are happy to announce 2031 01:23:38,640 --> 01:23:39,972 they have reach agreement 2032 01:23:39,973 --> 01:23:43,351 that recognizes Mr. Finger significant contribution 2033 01:23:43,352 --> 01:23:45,603 to Batman family character. 2034 01:23:45,604 --> 01:23:47,021 We are happy to confirm today 2035 01:23:47,022 --> 01:23:49,398 that Bill Finger will receive credit 2036 01:23:49,399 --> 01:23:52,026 on Warner Brothers television series & apos; Gotham & apos; 2037 01:23:52,027 --> 01:23:54,320 and in the future film, 2038 01:23:54,321 --> 01:23:57,782 & apos; Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice. "" 2039 01:23:57,783 --> 01:24:01,285 ♪ 2040 01:24:01,286 --> 01:24:03,871 Our goal is to get Bill's name attached. 2041 01:24:03,872 --> 01:24:06,082 That's what we do. 2042 01:24:06,083 --> 01:24:07,833 We change history. Batman comics 2043 01:24:07,834 --> 01:24:11,337 Bob Kane said... 2044 01:24:11,338 --> 01:24:14,006 I often ask myself, 2045 01:24:14,007 --> 01:24:16,008 "Why did he do this for years? " 2046 01:24:16,009 --> 01:24:18,052 2047 01:24:18,053 --> 01:24:20,346 2048 01:24:20,347 --> 01:24:23,057 2049 01:24:23,058 --> 01:24:26,894 2050 01:24:26,895 --> 01:24:28,020 2051 01:24:28,021 --> 01:24:30,439 2052 01:24:30,440 --> 01:24:34,193 2053 01:24:34,194 --> 01:24:39,740 And I believe he is just excited about it. 2054 01:24:39,741 --> 01:24:43,995 He believes in causing him to write about. 2055 01:24:43,996 --> 01:24:46,747 You might wonder if I find any photos 2056 01:24:46,748 --> 01:24:48,791 Bill Finger in the backyard 2057 01:24:48,792 --> 01:24:51,377 cut grass with his clothes. 2058 01:24:51,378 --> 01:24:54,463 And the answer is yes, yes, I did. 2059 01:24:54,464 --> 01:24:56,173 (laughter) 2060 01:24:56,174 --> 01:24:57,967 You're welcome, women. 2061 01:24:57,968 --> 01:24:59,969 The driving force, still, 2062 01:24:59,970 --> 01:25:01,637 is wrong right 2063 01:25:01,638 --> 01:25:04,056 and try to stay on the good side. 2064 01:25:04,057 --> 01:25:05,766 So you can't see Bill too well from where you are, 2065 01:25:05,767 --> 01:25:07,059 but he is in the shadows. 2066 01:25:07,060 --> 01:25:09,895 Marc always strives for equality 2067 01:25:09,896 --> 01:25:12,315 and that's really all of him, 2068 01:25:12,316 --> 01:25:13,566 I mean, that's it. 2069 01:25:13,567 --> 01:25:15,860 He is very brave, he is a very brave person. 2070 01:25:15,861 --> 01:25:18,738 He really... if he thinks that something is unfair, 2071 01:25:18,739 --> 01:25:19,905 he will do it. 2072 01:25:19,906 --> 01:25:23,034 So I think it's not finally, honest. 2073 01:25:23,035 --> 01:25:24,410 There are always more stories. 2074 01:25:24,411 --> 01:25:26,245 I mean, what I always do say there is no story 2075 01:25:26,246 --> 01:25:28,080 from history ends in one period. 2076 01:25:28,081 --> 01:25:29,707 They all end with dots, dots, dots. 2077 01:25:29,708 --> 01:25:30,791 We are just waiting for someone 2078 01:25:30,792 --> 01:25:32,543 to find the next part. 2079 01:25:32,544 --> 01:25:40,544 ♪ 2080 01:25:41,762 --> 01:25:43,596 Do you want to do it lashes too? 2081 01:25:43,597 --> 01:25:45,598 - Sure. - Yes? 2082 01:25:45,599 --> 01:25:47,600 Again, I will be in movies and others, 2083 01:25:47,601 --> 01:25:48,684 - so I want... - Yes, we can add 2084 01:25:48,685 --> 01:25:51,103 - eyelashes if you like. - Good. 2085 01:25:51,104 --> 01:25:53,731 So what are you doing? people shooting? 2086 01:25:53,732 --> 01:25:56,984 That's a documentary about my grandfather. 2087 01:25:56,985 --> 01:25:59,278 He is the original author 2088 01:25:59,279 --> 01:26:00,988 and Batman co-creators. 2089 01:26:00,989 --> 01:26:02,365 - No kidding. - Mm-hm. 2090 01:26:02,366 --> 01:26:03,449 That's awesome. 2091 01:26:03,450 --> 01:26:04,533 (laugh) 2092 01:26:04,534 --> 01:26:12,534 ♪ 2093 01:26:14,127 --> 01:26:15,795 I don't have black socks. 2094 01:26:15,796 --> 01:26:23,796 ♪ 2095 01:26:27,057 --> 01:26:28,599 Almost arrived. 2096 01:26:28,600 --> 01:26:35,564 ♪ 2097 01:26:35,565 --> 01:26:36,649 Alright, Alethia, tell me, 2098 01:26:36,650 --> 01:26:38,442 what's the problem with the skin? 2099 01:26:38,443 --> 01:26:46,443 ♪ 2100 01:26:49,037 --> 01:26:51,664 This is my tenth Batman's first stage, 2101 01:26:51,665 --> 01:26:53,999 but this is very special because this is the first time 2102 01:26:54,000 --> 01:26:56,210 that Finger Bill is getting credit screen 2103 01:26:56,211 --> 01:26:57,920 in a big film 2104 01:26:57,921 --> 01:27:00,131 for Batman's co-creation. 2105 01:27:00,132 --> 01:27:02,466 And that's very, very interesting to me. 2106 01:27:02,467 --> 01:27:04,760 It's amazing that it's years later, 2107 01:27:04,761 --> 01:27:07,471 we are now on a journey with his grandson 2108 01:27:07,472 --> 01:27:10,099 and grandson go to the premiere 2109 01:27:10,100 --> 01:27:12,935 where the name finally will appear on the screen. 2110 01:27:12,936 --> 01:27:14,770 I am very happy. 2111 01:27:14,771 --> 01:27:18,399 ♪ 2112 01:27:18,400 --> 01:27:21,694 That is a curse in our lives. 2113 01:27:21,695 --> 01:27:24,864 Bill is unknown, not appreciated. 2114 01:27:24,865 --> 01:27:27,324 My father is in the same position. 2115 01:27:27,325 --> 01:27:31,036 I tried to overcome it with my father's death. 2116 01:27:31,037 --> 01:27:32,830 I hope that I have broken that 2117 01:27:32,831 --> 01:27:35,082 by getting a closure for Bill, 2118 01:27:35,083 --> 01:27:38,544 for myself, and for my son, 2119 01:27:38,545 --> 01:27:40,045 so we can move forward 2120 01:27:40,046 --> 01:27:44,091 and don't have this dark cloud 2121 01:27:44,092 --> 01:27:45,926 follow us. 2122 01:27:45,927 --> 01:27:51,223 ♪ 2123 01:27:51,224 --> 01:27:53,684 It's been ten years I've told this story, 2124 01:27:53,685 --> 01:27:56,729 and hear Bill die and be buried 2125 01:27:56,730 --> 01:27:58,731 in the grave of the poor, in the potter's field, 2126 01:27:58,732 --> 01:28:00,065 very powerful, 2127 01:28:00,066 --> 01:28:02,443 and that's the only story that anyone knows. 2128 01:28:02,444 --> 01:28:04,737 ♪ 2129 01:28:04,738 --> 01:28:09,450 Until I found two people who were both familiar with Fred, 2130 01:28:09,451 --> 01:28:10,743 Bill's son, 2131 01:28:10,744 --> 01:28:12,953 and who told me a different story. 2132 01:28:12,954 --> 01:28:16,791 ♪ 2133 01:28:16,792 --> 01:28:18,626 So what do these two people say 2134 01:28:18,627 --> 01:28:20,878 is that Fred did come forward after Bill died 2135 01:28:20,879 --> 01:28:22,880 and only... he doesn't have a day when he died, 2136 01:28:22,881 --> 01:28:23,923 that's why he doesn't show up 2137 01:28:23,924 --> 01:28:26,967 in the medical examiner report. 2138 01:28:26,968 --> 01:28:28,552 Fred told his father to be cremated, 2139 01:28:28,553 --> 01:28:31,013 and he lives in Oregon at that time. 2140 01:28:31,014 --> 01:28:32,473 ♪ 2141 01:28:32,474 --> 01:28:34,934 And he took the ashes to the shoreline 2142 01:28:34,935 --> 01:28:36,894 near where he lives. 2143 01:28:36,895 --> 01:28:37,978 ♪ 2144 01:28:37,979 --> 01:28:40,064 Spread on the sand 2145 01:28:40,065 --> 01:28:42,441 in the form of bats. 2146 01:28:42,442 --> 01:28:44,944 ♪ 2147 01:28:44,945 --> 01:28:48,405 And let the water enter and wash it to the sea. 2148 01:28:48,406 --> 01:28:56,406 ♪ 2149 01:29:07,342 --> 01:29:08,592 Have fun. 2150 01:29:08,593 --> 01:29:12,054 ♪ 2151 01:29:12,055 --> 01:29:15,474 Uh, one "Batman v Superman" please? 2152 01:29:15,475 --> 01:29:23,475 ♪ 2153 01:30:41,561 --> 01:30:49,561 ♠Translated by: www.subtitlecinema.com